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If Neil deGrasse Tyson (no 2) is what’s considered sexy these days, I’m a lot better looking than I thought.
That was nice, happy holidays to you.May next year see a steady increase in atheism,universal brotherhood.
I second that notion.
I was clicking thru the pictures, & I mistook Sam Harris for Ben Stiller.
Well they are both jews who are among the most inbred of all American demographics.
So you admit there’s a racial element to being jewish?
Jews are not members of a race or ethnicity. They are members of a religion. Labeling oneself as an Atheist Jew makes about as much sense as labeling oneself as an Atheist Mormon.
zeke, you’re wrong. Jewish is an ethnicity AND a race AND a religion. You may want to look up those words in the dictionary.
No. You are wrong. The definitions of the words are not met.
No, Im admitting that jewish tribalism has resulted in inbreeding among American jews in the same way that fundamentalist mormons are inbred. Google Tay-Sachs disease.
Jew:
1. An adherent of Judaism as a religion or culture.
2. A member of the widely dispersed people originally descended from the ancient Hebrews and sharing an ethnic heritage based on Judaism.
3. A native or inhabitant of the ancient kingdom of Judah.
Ethnicity (from the Political dictionary):
The only working general definition of ethnicity is that it involves the common consciousness of shared origins and traditions.
Race:
1. A local geographic or global human population distinguished as a more or less distinct group by genetically transmitted physical characteristics.
2. A group of people united or classified together on the basis of common history, nationality, or geographic distribution: the German race.
3. A genealogical line; a lineage.
4. Humans considered as a group.
5. Biology.
a. An interbreeding, usually geographically isolated population of organisms differing from other populations of the same species in the frequency of hereditary traits. A race that has been given formal taxonomic recognition is known as a subspecies.
b. A breed or strain, as of domestic animals.
Jews meet all of the criteria. I rest my case.
I think we all know the definitions of the words race and ethnicity. The definition is not met unless it is relaxed so much that it would mean that there are literally millions of ethnicities and races.
Obviously you don’t.
It’s all right to stand corrected, you know.
You don’t actually know any jews do you? Most would tell you that jews are neither members of race or a religion. So why do you persist with such claims? Very strange. My best guess is that some other unquestioned belief of yours hinges upon acceptance of your invalid claims of race and religion.
That doesn’t change the meaning of the definitions.
Contradicted yourself there, didn’t you? Your prior claim is that jewish is strictly a religion. Now it’s ‘neither/nor’.
Take it up w/the English language, not me.
More strange, are people who don’t want to accept the general definitions.
LMAO! Are you kidding me? Loki’s wager?
Yeah, your ‘best guess’ is pretty sad.
No contradiction. Just a typo. Should have read:
Most would tell you that jews are neither members of a race or an ethnicity.
If you actually knew some jews then you would likely know that. Jews are a religious group only. Atheist Mormon … ridiculous … Atheist Jew … ridiculous.
See? Typos are misspelled words. Of course, you tend to favor definitions of your own convenience.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Secular_Jewish_culture
The Jewish people is generally considered to be an ethnoreligious community rather than solely a religious grouping;
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jewish_atheism
Jewish atheism is practiced by atheists who are ethnically Jewish and members of the Jewish people. Because Jewishness encompasses ethnic as well as religious components, the term “Jewish atheism” does not necessarily imply any kind of contradiction.
http://jewishatheist.blogspot.com/
http://atheistjew.blogspot.com/
http://baconeatingatheistjew.blogspot.com/
I don’t think I need to go on. If you keep denying reality, there’s no use.
The real jews were mostly wiped out by the nazi/zionist alliance during ww2.What is left are mostly khazar converts to talmudic judaism.
That’s 1 of the more insane things I’ve heard you say. You can’t be serious.
KA
All you have demonstrated is that there are some atheists that mistakenly think that they can be jewish as well. They can not. Jews are a religious group only. They do not fit any reasonable definition of the words race or ethnicity. Are Mormons a race? Are they an ethnic group?
Blind insistence isn’t an argument, or a point.
Obviously you don’t know any secular jews.
I have demonstrated beyond a reasonable doubt that they do indeed fall into those categories. Strangely, you refuse to admit that the standard definitions as well as the nuanced categories of both race & ethnicity support my claim.
You are batting exactly zero, & your obstinate refusal to apply reason & rationality makes you look exceedingly foolish.
Pet theories should be discarded, not clung to like a child’s security blanket.
Anyone can change meanings of words or ignore meanings of words.
I’m an ethnic Jew. Israel recognizes me as such, so do my neighbours, friends, co-workers, family members, and most of the world.
Hitler would not have asked me if I believed in God or not.
When Jew haters state that Jews control the world, I’m lumped in with the Jews in this instance.
There is also a Jewish culture. Even Richard Dawkins recently said he considers himself a cultural Christian.
Maybe 200 years, the world won’t consider the idea of a cultural or ethnic Jew…..but that is not the case today.
KA
Yes the zionists worked with the nazis.They sat on the jewish councils that were set up by nazis.In that role they selected the names of who got sent to the camps and they knew what went on in those camps.There were even lawsuits by people after the war.And they sure as hell didn’t select the non zionist jews.You can dress it up any way you want but nazi and zionist worldview are similiar both are paranoid, ethnic based and both believe the ends justify the means.
No. All you did was list some definitions of the words “race” and “ethnicity”. I take no exception to those definitions. If I would have listed them first would that, in your “mind”, mean that you sould admit defeat. Weird.
Jews simply do not fit the definition. I can be white, black, brown or asian and still be a jew so they obviously don’t fit the definition of a race. Similarly jews are from very different parts of the world with very different cultures etc so the ethinicty definition is not met.
You, like The Atheist Jew, can choose your own definition of words. Then they will have meaning only to you. Communicating with yourself has limited usefulness.
Ah – yes, those are standard definitions.
Obviously you do, or you wouldn’t be having this discussion still.
WTF? Are you high?
Still don’t know the definition(s) of race, I see. Race isn’t necessarily demarcated by skin color. Familiar w/the term ‘Semite’?
It’s not an absolute requirement, because being jewish is also a religion, but not just a religion.
Ah, dude, I took those ‘personal definitions’ straight off of online dictionaries. So, they’re not my ‘personal definitions’. Do you even know how to use a dictionary?
& weren’t you the clown who started with, “If you knew any jews, you’d know that’s wrong?” But if an actual jew comes along & corrects you, then they’re wrong? Did you miss the point about Dawkins calling himself a cultural xtian? Of course you did – it sailed right over your head, because obstinacy in your fantasy world is an adequate substitute for logic.
Words to live by. Luckily, the only person in this discussion that’s doing that is you.
The only thing you qualify for w/your schizophrenic repetitions, is therapy.
reason, I’m going to have to demand some evidence for this outrageous claim of yours, otherwise I’m ranking it as crazed.
Are you truly as stupid as you appear. There are black, white and asian jews. Are they all of the same race? Your argument making skills suck.
Listen, for the last time: being Jewish is a race AND a religion AND an ethnicity. It’s not an either/or proposition (which is a false dichotomy, BTW). I’m going to have to go out on a limb, & state that I’m not the stupid 1 here. You may have noticed this entire discussion began when I mistook Harris for Stiller.
No, your comprehension ’skills’ rate you @ about middle school level.
You argue just like a theist. Quite poorly, in fact.
You are having great difficulty following a simple argument. I have not declared this to be an “either/or proposition”. I have said jews are NEITHER a race NOR an ethnicity. They are ONLY a religion.
Anybody that declares themselves to be an atheist jew is declaring there willingness to be manipulated by real jews.
WTF? I know exactly what you’re saying.
Yeah, I’m not the 1 who’s having difficulties here. That IS an either/or proposition. If you were brighter, you’d know that.
I see now. Your fragile little worldview is composed of evil religious jews manipulating people from the shadows. Admitting the fact that jews are ALSO a race/ethnicity would put you squarely in the category of being a racist.
Can’t have the truth now, can we? Oh, no, that’ll never do.
OK then, KA, point out where I or anybody else on this thread wrote anything about an either/or proposition. Nobody has written that jews are either a religious group or a race/ethnicity. What they have written is that they are simply not a race or ethnicity because they don’t fit the definitions. You even provided the definitions. Is really something unclear about that?
All you are doing with your ridiculous talk of jewish race and ethnicity is helping to shield a religion from criticism by allowing them to duck under whatever rock suits them when criticism arises.
Wow. Just wow. Saying it’s strictly a religion is an either/or proposition. Either it is or it isn’t. What are they teaching middle school children these days? Obviously not English.
You’re deliberately misrepresenting. You insist they are strictly a religion, I’ve amply demonstrated they can be 2 other things.
That’s incredible. They DO fit the definitions.
So…wait: you agree w/the definitions only when it suits you? You remind me of juror #3 in 12 Angry Men when he insists that ‘you bleeding hearts are twisting everything up!” & refuses to admit logical deductions.
Quoth the reality denier. No, I’ve never said any such thing. Nobody’s above criticism, nobody. Can you recognize someone of jewish descent? By that, I mean can you recognize someone who’s of jewish descent, that has distinct Middle Eastern traits? People like Mel Brooks, Stiller, Harris? I can. Because there’s a racial quality to that specific sort of jew.
KA
Man are you dense. By “either/or proposition” you made clear that you meant a “false dichotomy”. Look up the words you use before you use them. There is no false dichotomy.
The definitions for race and ethnicity are not met. If you think they are met that show us all how this is so and stop playing apologist for this one particular religion.
Well, you have a distinct penchant for cherry-picking your definitions:
The logical fallacy of false dilemma (also called false dichotomy, the either-or fallacy) involves a situation in which only two alternatives are considered, when in fact there are other options. Closely related are failing to consider a range of options and the tendency to think in extremes, called black-and-white thinking.
Exactly what you’re doing, whether you admit it or not.
I’ve already done this – you insisted somehow that I was using ‘false definitions’ (without providing any of your own, I might add, outside of “we all know what the words mean”), when I used standard definitions.
& I’m not ‘playing apologist’ for any damn thing. Judaism’s a crock of shit, like any other religion. Being jewish, however, is more than 1 thing, which I’m tired of explaining to a dishonest little pseudo-intellectual like yourself.
So tell us what the false dichotomy is that I have said exists. LOL.
Also, I didn’t suggest that your definition is “false”, whatever that means, I said they are not met? Why are you so confused?
Really, how old are you? You’re inferring a false dichotomy, by insisting that jewish is strictly a religion. Either it is or it isn’t: you insist that it strictly is, ergo, false dichotomy. Also, I’m accusing you of using 1, not that you said you were doing it.
You haven’t demonstrated that they’re not ‘met’, you made a bald assertion w/o demonstration. “That doesn’t count” is a statement: you need to back it up.
Talk about projection.
It’s simple: I made a claim. I supported that claim by presenting evidence (that a rational mind would likely accept). Thus far you’ve done nothing but hand-waving.
Either you’re a theist masquerading as an atheist, or you’re a middle school student rattling a metaphorical saber.
Either way, you’re wrong.
How is that a false dichotomy? Is it a false dichotomy to say that mormons are strictly a religion. No it isn’t. It is simply the truth. And the truth is that jews are not a race or ethnicity but they are a religion.
Dude, your melon doesn’t work right.
I know a couple of Jews from Israel. They’re quite secular. I’m pretty sure they consider themselves a race of common ethnic heritage. If there’s a religious bond, I’d bet they don’t fuss over it much. Much like I don’t fuss over the fact my family inherited xian superstition. It’s basically something I have to tolerate at funerals. That’s all.
And by the way, my Jewish friends are quite beautiful. I’m skeptical of inbreeding due to the genetic symmetry associated with physical beauty. I could be wrong though.
We’re not talking about mormons.
They can be any of the 3. So no, that’s not the truth.
It’s simple logic. Something you don’t quite grasp, obviously.
Cry4turtles, thanks for pitching in. BEAJ, you too. Thanks to both of you.
Zeke is evidencing a black ‘n white mindset, which is fundamental to the false dichotomy. NTM the fundamentalists.
Here’s the capper: you have to be jewish to be able to have dual citizenship in Israel. Israel is now 51% secular (read: non-religious). So, if someone becomes a secular jew, in accordance w/zeke’s & reason’s logic, a large % wouldn’t be citizenry anymore. Yet oddly, no mass extradition is taking place anywhere in Israel. In fact, BEAJ stated he’s an atheist, but would be accepted in Israel anyways. Zionism was a secular cause anyways.
The ancient israelites referred to themselves as the ‘holy race’, Hitler claimed the jews were a separate race, & I’d be willing to bet that many muslim arabs would agree on the ethnicity/race thing w/me as well.
Game, set, match.
They have been met.
Tired of engaging in a battle of wits w/an unarmed man.
I hereby dub thee the the black knight.
I’ll just mosey off to the sound of coconuts being clapped together…
rumor has it that Dave was too modest and removed his picture
They kept insisting… begging even, to nclude me in the countdown, but I decided to let someone else get the glory. I’m selfless that way.
David you should do a calendar spread and donate the proceeds to AA.
I’d naturally select them any day.
Yeah I know that was bad >.>
We were all thinking along those lines. It had to be said.
For the coming year i forecast a strong recovery with the dow reaching 4500 and unemployment no higher than 27%.Let the good times roll USA is back.
2010 will continue to see America change in ways few expected…
http://threatswatch.org/analysis/2009/12/wither-sovereignty/
It will not be change for the better.The robber barons have gone international.When the currency crisis hits the last of our freedom will disappear.
Rush Limbaugh hospitalized with chest pain and in serious condition. Nothing a little exercise and a vegetarian diet wouldn’t have prevented. But excess and denial ruled his life and politics. What a waste of a life.
Here we have a classic example of the superiority of atheist morality and compassion…
Denial? That’s funny…by it’s very definition atheism is a life that denies the Truth…
To phreedm
The scum that collects at the bottom of a stagnant pool where animals come to die is superior to Rush Limbaugh. He is the lowest and most pathetic scum that I have ever seen the Christian Religion produce. And may his false God call him home before the dawning of another day. But since his God is false I guess that is not likely to happen.
Back to the Atheist Jew discussion:
I consider myself an Atheist Presbyterian. I may have ditched god and Jesus and the holy ghost, but I can’t get rid of John Calvin and John Knox. They sit on my shoulder, along with a Sticket Minister, and irritate the heck out of me. All those Presbyterian values! Dignity, frugality, modesty, etc. And they absolutely do not want me to have any fun.
Bertrand Russell said that Atheist Catholics are generally happier than Atheist Protestants. We keep trying to laugh and dance, but it is difficult.
My moral values were formed in the Southern Baptist church I grew up in. That was decades before the right-wing takeover of the SBC, and many of the sermons I heard were quite reasonable. It was in one of them that I first heard the expression “One man’s right to swing his fists ends where the other man’s nose begins.”
When I leffed the church, I didn’t have much moral rethinking to do, other than the superstition-based doctrines such as the sex taboos.
Jewsagainstzionism.com addresses the can you be atheist and jewish question.They also have the good info on nazi/zionist dealings and the holocaust.
Yes reason, prior to 1933 or 1934 Zionists were trying to deal with the Nazis, much like Israel is trying to negotiate with Hamas about a soldiers release.
Mein Kempf basically stated that Jews were going to get kicked out if Hitler had his way. Some Zionists definitely tried to work with this knowledge to help their cause, maybe over the cause of just getting Jews out.
As for comparing Israel to Nazis, I think it is laughable you call yourself “reason.”
Israel is a place for Jews to escape anti-semitism and be treated as equals, at first on non sovereign land. The Nazis were about European conquest of sovereign land and superiority, and throw in genocide.
Israel practices Reverse Genocide. In 1948 there were 1.2 million Palestinians. Today there are 4 million in Gaza and the West Bank and another 4 or 5 million in the world. Plus another 1 million Arabs inside of Israel who are mostly the descendants of the 200,000 Arabs who stayed within Israel’s sovereign borders after the 1948 war.
I have a better nickname for you…..how about clueless?
Nice try atheist jew.Zionists had dealings with nazis long after 1934.
As for gaza,west bank bulldozing orchards,evicting people from their land and other abominations should be an affront to all atheist or religious.
Could you please provide some evidence for all your ramblings?
Atheist Jew,
Clueless would certainly be a good name for you. Or Almost Clueless.
But at least, you can argue with KA about whether Jews are a “race”.
Good retort Not So Fast, are you a member of MENSA?
I very nicely managed to put forth my claim & substantiate it w/o descending into acrimony immediately. Something that none of the latest spate of “atheists” seem able to do.
In fact, “It’s not because I say it’s not!” isn’t an argument, it’s a temper tantrum.
Holy crap, that site’s run by lunatics. So…the Zionists promoted the Holocaust to implement Israel?
That’s 3 pounds of stupid in a 1 pound bag.
KA
You can’t deny the torah and be a jew.You can’t deny new testament and be a christian.You can’t deny koran and be a muslim.
Jewsagainstzionism cites the words written and spoken by the zionists themselves, how does that make them lunatics?
You have no problem agreeing that communists for example did horrible things.Yet when it comes to zionists the blinders go on.
I don’t call for destruction of Israel but i don’t support false history either.Israel will not collapse no more than USA did when people learned we treated native people like crap.
You got 2 of 3. I’ve amply demonstrated that jews are also an ethnicity, as well as a race.
I’ll bet the rent you took them @ face value, & did no research on the matter. I could use websites that agree w/me, but I don’t. I use objective facts only.
I’ve done no such thing, & am tired of this baseless claim. Please show your work. Where have I ever excused anyone from anything?
Well finally we agree on something, but I’d also bet the rent that the ‘zionist plotted w/the nazis to start the Holocaust’ is utter bullshit.
Besides which, anyone who knows the actual history knows that old Adolph had a running deal w/the Mufti of Jerusalem.
KA
Zionists are the enemy within.Israel is a major false flag operator.
Israel should trust USA and disarm, USA will protect jews.We believe in peace and the other stuff.Don’t you trust us judge us by our record.
Holy crap, that site’s run by lunatics. So…the Zionists promoted the Holocaust to implement Israel?
That’s 3 pounds of stupid in a 1 pound bag.
Ok folks I just made a $40 dollar contribution to American Atheists. If a Theist can contribute to a just cause let’s see how many Atheists or non Christian Theists can as well.