Religion is a stupid idea. We all know it, but we rarely say it. Not that only stupid people are religious, but that religion is a stupid idea that is sometimes believed by smart people due mainly to an effort to escape their own mortality. It’s true that religion is stupid, it’s also true that it’s politically incorrect to say so. My opinion is that we’ve been nice for the past several years (”I respect your beliefs even though I disagree”), and it’s time to be a little honest. What say ye?
I’d prefer you did have a problem with my thinking you’re wrong because then you might want to do something about it: arguing for your position or accepting the validity of mine.
I attend church services with my parents twice on Sunday and again on Wednesday so I hope you’ll pardon me if I am amused at your expence.
If there were any other way to interpret the evidence, of what use would faith be?
Incorrect. Its a matter of numbers: the good of the many over the good of the one. If I were put in a similar situation, say my life for the lives of all the inmates in America’s prison system, the choice is obvious: I would be dead in a heart-beat.
Besides, Jesus didn’t make much of a sacrifice did he? A temporarly (albeit painful) death? And then he gets to sit at the right hand of God for eternity? Hell, that’s not even a tough choice, that’s a steal.
semovera,
[Emphasis added]
First post:
[Note the initial setup here, that is, christianity is the goal.]
Continuing:
We understand your goal asshole!
You are a special christian just like all the rest, self-centered, deceptive and, disgusting. You are the REAL christian; dishonest.
Not mad mind you, simply showing that your tactics are not only; not effective, deceptive and, disgusting but also paint the true nature of the christian god-idea.
[Quackery that amounts to --- trying to prove his god-idea exists outside of his mind.]
Shifting responsibility to an unknown third party, possibly the notably absent christian god-thing.
That is not the point. The point is that the fantasy you believe can only survive if it is supported by deception and insertion of statements such as, “that isn’t intended to be taken literally” when the christian discovers something that it doesn’t like.
Ending with this:
Followed by your lastest comment which I am sure was your original intent. I am sure because the mode of operation is exactly the same as all the other christians. Use deception to feign interest in your prey. Pretend to be interested in the comments made by the prey. Close the deal by stating that you have some special sauce that cannot be had without belief in fantasy. Used with liberal amounts of fear mongering.
semovera, you are just another disgusting, deceptive christian like all the rest.
Suck it, jeesus christ, already.
In response to knowledge is power,
Why should I have to argue for my position. Again, the evidence is there if you look for it. It is well publicized and speaks for itself. Even ardent atheists such as Antony Flew can attest to this. Maybe, your atheistic mind set is more volitional than anything else. I could be wrong tough. As far as attending church services, my friend that is awesome, however, attending church does not make one a Christian. I am willing to bet that some that I have had dialogue with on this site are more “Christian” than those who attend church. Going to church is an outward act, but it does not mean that you walk the walk, according to the words of Jesus. And for the last point, again you underestimate the God of the Bible. It is not a matter of numbers, it is a matter of a being highly superior to us in every way shape and form stooping down to a “lower level,” and then suffering a humiliating death, fully knowing that the majority of the very people He created would reject what He did. It would be akin to you turning into an ant, living your life as an ant just so that a few could be everything that they were supposed to be. I use a very simplistic example, but hopefully you see where I’m coming from. For Christians, the sacrifice is not trivial, nor is it a steal…it is downright unfathomable.
semovera,
The atheist mindset really is as simple as this: Atheists are unconvinced (i.e. they don’t believe) that a deity exists. Any other political, social, or moral thoughts that run through an atheist’s mind are unrelated to atheism and are not part of the atheist mindset.
Well, given that there are thousands of different flavors of Christianity (some mutually contradictory), I would venture a guess that no one has an understanding of what Christianity is all about. It’ far too scattershot for anyone to comprehend fully.
Well, no, not really. There is no evidence in favor of atheism. There is simply a lack of evidence for a deity, ergo we default to atheism.
Any time someone comes up with a new argument for a deity, all atheists can do is refute it. As I’ve already said, there is likely no way to prove that a deity doesn’t exist.
Thank you.
How so?
I wouldn’t be surprised either, and I’ll be the first to apologize if it would be helpful, but I can’t do that unless you point out any errors I may have made.
Actually, I would say that it does.
I know you said you aren’t suffering from some guilt syndrome, but it certainly seems that way.
If you wanted to explain why you think you’re a bad person, perhaps we could try to convince you otherwise? I’m all for helping people out if they want it, but if you’re content to go on believing that, then I won’t press the issue.
I have nothing to lose from entertaining ideas within my mind, and trust me, I have entertained the possibility of a deity plenty of times.
I don’t know. How can we find out?
Rna2Dna,
My friend I have no problem with you not believing what I believe. I also don’t have any special sauce or cure-all for life’s ills. Heck man, I already told you that I am in no way some sort of moral beacon of excellence. Deceptive, yeah I’ll admit sometimes I can be very deceptive and disgusting too. Thats real man…I can’t even begin to describe the depths. Take it at face value, I really do not have any interest in trying to sneak up on you or anybody for that matter. You are probably an intelligent, educated adult. I don’t need to peddle or sell my beliefs. They are what they are, just like yours. Christianity is not a goal or a multi-level marketing scheme, where I get some kind of commission for recruiting members. I wanted to make a distinction as to what I believed so that I could be clear with where I stood. Thats it man, nothing more nothing less.
I’ll get back with you guys a little later, if not definitely tomorrow. Duty calls. If I offended anyone, I apologize. Peace!!!
Semovera
After all of your posts I do not understand what motivates you to post here. Did you just come here to tell us that you, someone that we do not know, are a xian? We know xians exist.
http://secweb.infidels.org/?kiosk=articles&id=369
Anthony Flew seems very conflicted in his personal beliefs and does not lend credence to your assertion that there is any evidence for the existence of a god, much less the christian god. Especially considering that he has become a Deist, not a christian. Regardless, appeals to authority are somewhat less than persuasive.
‘Maybe’ is a funny word. Maybe you’re male; maybe you’re female; maybe you beat your wife.
Nor do I wish to be called one. Your statement was that those who are atheists:
As I am an atheist who also regularly attends church services, clearly this is not the case for me in particular. I would also go so far as to say that many atheists who choose to discuss theology with theists also understand the intricacies of christian ideology: it is necessary to be effective.
You are certainly not the first to have said so.
You misunderstand my meaning: I do not attend church services for the sake of outward appearances (anyone who cares to ask know that I am an atheist), I go because I want to know why christians believe.
He didn’t lose anything: he’s still god, he’s still alive, and he’s still in dominion over the earth. That doesn’t constitute a sacrifice.
Religion isn’t just for gullible people afraid of their own mortality, it’s a staple for those in need of an identity and community. Look at how jews have brainwashed their kids into believing that no matter what they believe, no matter what their religion, no matter what their nationality, no matter what their race, that they are of an elite race, ethnicity and nationality.
Even Dave Silverman reveals his loyalty to this delusion and fear of being rejected by “jews” if he rejects this part of jewish dogma.
It may be politically incorrect to criticize religion, but jew forbid you say anything critical of judaism or zionism. When members did so Dave went off the deep end calling people “anti-semites” and “holocaust deniers” along with numerous other insults in an attempt to demonize anyone who treated judaism the same way Dave treats Islam or christianity.
If it’s time to be honest, Dave needs to be honest with himself and his own hypocrisy.
i will be the first to admit that religion is flawed… and in its long life might have cased more bad than good. religion is man made, therefore it is flawed.
where you all get it twisted is that you think that everyone whom is spiritual is religious. this could not be further from the truth.
as for me, i have a relationship the Lord and i do not attend church.
so where does that leave me… take the bible away, the relationship remains the same… what would you call me then.
one with no written rules, but lead by the spirit.
so… i thought this site would be ALOT more interesting, not just a bunch of bitter mf’ers bitchin because the rest of the world doesnt think like them.
YOU DONT BELIEVE IN ANYTHING. WHAT IS THE POINT OF TALKING ABOUT IT. SERIOUSLY, GET OFF YOUR ASS AND DO SOMETHING INSTEAD OF SITTIN ON YOUR COMPUTER WITH UR THUMBS UP YOUR ASSES THINKING OF SOME CYNICAL ASS SHIT TO SAY TO PEOPLE WHO ARE TRYING TO HAVE A REAL INTELLECTUAL CONVERSATION (NOT DEBATE).
PEACE
dmwilson,
Having a bad day are we?
To answer your civil questions:
Religion is a subset of spirituality? I can accept that. I’m not sure where the line is – but it’s not unreasonable on the face of it.
Assuming you identify yourself as a Christian, a lot of xians do not attend a church – they are still however xians. Xianity is a (or perhaps many) religion, therefore that would make you religious.
Taking the bible away is not the same as never having had the bible in the first place. The book in question has likely had a significant influence on your eventually selection of a religion. The decision point was likely reached after prolonged exposure to the bible throughout your formative years. Removing the book after the fact is not going to make much difference.
The rules are a part of the dogma that forms your version of xianity. You, and all xians, are forced to pick and choose the biblical rules they follow (and would like others to follow).
Obviously I am assuming a lot of facts about your experience here, and take it as given that some or all may not apply in your particular circumstance.
Are you too virtuous to spell out the term mother fuckers? Please let one of us bitter atheists take your sin upon our shoulders. Our pleasure – and no crucifixion required
dmwilson
Thank you for admitting that religion is man-made and flawed. Now if you will just go to the next step and realize that god is also man-made, you’ll be in our ball park.
So you have a relationship with the lord? Did the lord make you scream at us? I will admit, I am sitting at my computer, mother fucker that I am, but I do not have my thumbs up my ass. I use them for typing, you see. Plus, I fuck my mother with these hands. Though she probably wouldn’t care how sanitary they are, seeing how she’s been dead since ‘99.
So sorry we’ve disappointed you with our propensity toward debate. What was it you wanted to converse about? If you posted something, I must have missed it. (Probably busy fucking Mom again, poor Dear.) Was it the spirituality thing? Well I’d say that still puts you in the religious ball park, hon. That and the whole “relationship with the lord” kind of seals the deal.
PEACE! (I shouted it back to you, in case you’re just hard of hearing or you have your hands over your ears and you’re going LALALALALA!)