A number of e-mails and comments have been received criticizing the Board of Directors of American Atheists for its dismissal of Ellen Johnson as President. Acting President Frank Zindler has been answering at least some of these critics as time has allowed.In reply to one person who suggested that the dismissal was rash, precipitous, or even without cause, Zindler replied:
“Thank you for writing to American Atheists concerning the dismissal of President Ellen Johnson. Please be assured that this was not an action that was taken lightly or without an immense amount of agonizing on the part of all members of the board. Two special meetings of the Boards of Directors of American Atheists, Inc., and its four affiliated American Atheists corporations were held for the purpose of allowing Ms. Johnson to discuss policies concerning which she and the boards disagreed. For reasons known only to Ms. Johnson, she did not take part in those meetings and did nothing to resolve the issues in question. Consequently, at a third special meeting of the boards, a majority of the directors felt it their fiduciary responsibility to remove Ms. Johnson from the office of President, although she has not been removed from membership on the boards themselves.”
Several critics have argued that it was unfair or even treacherous to dismiss Ms. Johnson while on her civil-rights march to Mississippi. Zindler’s reply was
“Concerning Ms. Johnson’s ‘Bill Moore March’ through Alabama and Mississippi, I must inform you that this was carried out without the sponsorship of American Atheists, Inc. For complex legal reasons, the Board of Directors had instructed her not to do that in any way that would give the impression that the action was an official activity of American Atheists, Inc.”
Several of Zindler’s letters have contained the following paragraph:
“I hope you will understand that most of the members of the boards of directors are seasoned Atheists with long experience in American Atheists, Inc., going back to an early period in the career of Madalyn Murray O’Hair. We care deeply for the organization she founded and wish to see it prosper. We honor her memory and seek by all legal means available to advance her cause — the cause of Atheist civil liberties, separation of state and church, and the liberation of the human mind. We feel now more than ever that this is the most important Atheist organization in America — not only in what it is trying to do but also in what it is in fact doing.”
One writer has even alleged that the boards dismissed Ellen for reasons of power or personal gain, to which Zindler replied:
“Your assertion that the Board dismissed Ms. Johnson ‘for seemingly no better reason that to exercise power’ is particularly troubling, as it presumes either that we acted out of whim — i.e., with no compelling reason of fiduciary responsibility — or that we somehow will enjoy personal gain from this painful action. I cannot expect you to believe that we did in fact have important reasons of fiduciary responsibility for the simple reason that I am not at liberty to tell you what those were. However, as for the second assumption — that of personal gain from exercise of power — I would have you know that all the Directors of the Board serve without salary, as do the Secretary and Treasurer. Although Ms. Johnson as President did receive a very modest salary, as Acting President I am serving without pay — as I have done for 13 years as Managing Editor of American Atheist Press (itself a full-time job). “I will be Acting President probably for only five or six months, until a new President can be selected. Nevertheless, I hope you will stay with us and help us in our fight against the forces of ignorance and superstition — not only through my brief tenure in an office I never sought, but also into the future with whomever succeeds me.”
Zindler also has expressed gratitude for Ellen’s accomplishments in many of his replies, for example “I agree with you perhaps more than you can appreciate that Ellen Johnson has been a brilliant and effective leader of the Atheist movement and has made many extremely important contributions to the cause of reason, Atheist civil liberties, and separation of state and church.”
nancyjensen1213,
Careful, she’ll accuse you of misogyny, you know
Dear friends,
I have thought long and hard about the decision I made about withdrawing my sponsorship of “The Atheist Viewpoint”.
This has not been an easy decision to make because I am torn between what the board did to Ellen and the fact that the voice of Atheism and rational thought must never be dimmed.
Today I read and heard numerous times of the comments that “reverend” John Haggee made about the catholic church and also that “god sent Adolf Hitler to the jews”…
I am attaching just one of the articles on Hagge and how John McCain has now rejected the Haggee endorsement. Hopefully this will show the nation how ridiculous and frightening fundamentalist religion really is.
After seeing that Haggee will be picking up where the (thankfully) departed delusional Jerry Falwell left off in his outrageous “faith filled” mindless spewing of hate, I have decided while I do not agree with the boards decision to fire Ellen, I must (after really thinking hard about this) yield to the greater good of continuing to give American Atheists a “voice” in the very catholic and evangelical/ protestant populated city of “saint” cloud, MN.
I have decided to continue my membership in American Atheists as well as continue to sponsor “The Atheist Viewpoint ” here on Charter Cable Channel 12 on Tuesday evenings at 7:30 PM Central Time.
Please know that my greatest and most sincere hope is that Ellen and the board can work through all of their difficulties and Ellen will be re-instated as President and Co-Host of “The Atheist Viewpoint”.
I care about Ellen and I care about the future of American Atheists.
I finally had to realize that much, much more was at stake here than we realize…..
The very survival of the human race is in jeopardy if fundamentalist, irrational religious zealots like John Haggee are not challenged with rationality, proof of the lies and errors of the bible and stopped.
I hope that all of you, especially Ellen can understand my position.
I met so many of you wonderful people at the American Atheists convention in Minneapolis and you all made me proud to be counted among you as a fellow secular humanist.
Please. Make me proud again. Let’s all try to work together for a rational world and put our differences aside once and for all for the common good. Our world and the future of our human species is literally at stake here.
Timothy, please continue to mail me Atheist Viewpoint Episodes.
Thank you.
Sincerely,
Jack Richter An American Atheist…just like YOU!
McCain Denounces Hagee
Updated 5:10 p.m.
By Juliet Eilperin and Michelle Boorstein
Sen. John McCain (R-Ariz.) today rejected the endorsement of megachurch pastor and ardent Zionist John Hagee after learning of a sermon in which Hagee posited that Nazism was God’s will.
Hagee’s sermon was delivered in the late 1990s but a video of it began circulating widely this week on the Web on the site talk2action, which monitors the religious right. The sermon calls Hitler a “hunter,” a reference to the Book of Jeremiah, which quotes God saying he “will restore [the Jews] to the land I gave to their forefathers.”
Hagee is one of the country’s best-known evangelical Christian Zionists; he founded a pro-Israel alliance of Christian groups and has donated tens of millions from his Texas-based ministry to support humanitarian causes in Israel. He has said he is driven by the belief that the creation of the state of Israel, and the return of Jews to Palestine, are God’s will.
“A hunter is someone with a gun and he forces you. Hitler was a hunter,” Hagee says in the sermon. “And the Bible says — Jeremiah writing — ‘They shall hunt them from every mountain and from every hill and from the holes of the rocks,’ meaning there’s no place to hide. And that might be offensive to some people but don’t let your heart be offended. I didn’t write it, Jeremiah wrote it. It was the truth and it is the truth. How did it happen? Because God allowed it to happen. Why did it happen? Because God said my top priority for the Jewish people is to get them to come back to the land of Israel.”
When asked what McCain thought of the remarks, campaign spokesman Tucker Bounds responded with an e-mail from the candidate, denouncing Hagee.
“Obviously, I find these remarks and others deeply offensive and indefensible, and I repudiate them,” McCain said. “I did not know of them before Reverend Hagee’s endorsement, and I feel I must reject his endorsement as well.”
The comments represented a significant shift by McCain, who had refused to reject Hagee’s endorsement despite controversial comments Hagee has made about Catholicism and his implication that Hurricane Katrina represented divine retribution. After learning of those comments, McCain said just because he accepts — or seeks — someone’s endorsement doesn’t mean he endorses that person’s views.
At roughly the same time McCain rejected Hagee’s endorsement, the reverend issued a statement saying he was withdrawing it to prevent any further damage to the presumptive GOP nominee’s candidacy.
“Ever since I endorsed John McCain for president, people seeking to attack Senator McCain have combed my records for statements they can use for political gain. They have had no qualms about grossly misrepresenting my position on issues most near and dear to my heart if it serves their political ambitions,” Hagee said in the statement. “I am tired of these baseless attacks and fear that they have become a distraction in what should be a national debate about important issues. I have therefore decided to withdraw my endorsement of Senator McCain for President effective today, and to remove myself from any active role in the 2008 campaign.”
The senator also made an effort to draw a distinction between his link to the controversial megapreacher and Sen. Barack Obama’s (D-Ill.) ties to Chicago Rev. Jeremiah Wright. Wright’s incendiary remarks about the U.S. government have dogged Obama for months.
“I have said I do not believe Senator Obama shares Reverend Wright’s extreme views. But let me also be clear, Reverend Hagee was not and is not my pastor or spiritual advisor, and I did not attend his church for twenty years,” McCain said in the statement. “I have denounced statements he made immediately upon learning of them, as I do again today.”
In talking to some influential people in American Atheists, I learned that Ellen could possibly be reinstated by the Board if she apologized to them.
I don’t see her doing that. How about if the Board and Ellen apologized to each other?
Atheist men, especially those of an older generation, have a long way to go before they are free from misogyny. I am hoping that perhaps some of these atheist men will read this and at least think about it and examine their deepest attitudes about the place of women. I know they will deny that they are misogynistic themselves and say, Oh no, NOT ME, my attitude toward Ellen has nothing to do with her being a [beautiful, competent] woman whom I might need to control, put down, override, punish, show who’s boss.
This is not about me, guys. You can try to discredit me all you want. It’s about Ellen. I strongly feel that this intelligent, competent, gorgeous, confident woman–the person I think should be on the media representing Atheists–may be being punished to show her who’s boss.
To be fair, entertain that notion just for a moment.
Actually, I’ve taken the past few days away from this board to do just that.
I asked myself whether I’d be as defensive of Ellen if she were more like her predecessor. Make whatever comparisons you wish. At that point, I realized that all I know of Ellen is her public personna and the gracious demeanor of her emails.
I haven’t the perspective of any of the board members – and certainly not that of Bart M. – who probably knows her best(and at her worst).
I’ve decided that I like Ellen as a spokesperson for AA because – from a marketing perspective – she could sell ME anything.
I could say as much of the women in my personal life – which is why I am now a committed bachelor.
Given that, I’ve decided that the reason I joined AA is the best reason to put internal politics aside and remain – to keep Viewpoint on the air in my area.
Matador, we’ve gone at it on this blog about misogyny, which I have accused the AA Board of Directors of being guilty of in dealing with Ellen. Now I have an updated comment on this matter:
Last Tuesday, the New York City Atheists held its monthly Meetup at the Stone Creek Pub in Manhattan. Usually we have slightly more men than women at this event
LAST TUESDAY,THERE WERE NO WOMEN.
Well, except for me, but I don’t count because I am one of the organizers of this event. THERE WERE 14 men and zero (0) women.
I don’t know what’s happening but I was afraid something like this might occur. ARE WOMEN KEEPING AWAY FROM ATHEIST EVENTS BECAUSE THEY’VE HEARD ABOUT WHAT’S HAPPENED TO ELLEN? Is this an ad hoc protest against the male-chauvinist pigdom within AA? Has the news spread that fast within the atheist community? Has misogyny within the Atheist movement come home to roost?
I personally will do nothing to build up women’s confidence in AA until the Board of Directors does something to exonerate Ellen.
As for you women out there who boycotted our last Meetup, I am totally with you. Frank, Conrad, Dick, all you guys out there who would never have stopped one another from fulfilling an obligation that you had planned, certainly not done such a thing publicly to a man, certainly not in such a humiliating manner as you treated Ellen, you can be sure that whatever influence I have in this Cause will be used to fight the anti-female attitude of your current boys’ club, to see that women officers and volunteers are treated with the same dignity, respect and cooperation that men are, and to boycott any decisions you make that deny an equally strong voice and respect to women.
May the memory of Madalyn live on!
Most members of the local group NYC Atheists — as with many other American Atheists affiliates — aren’t also members of the national group. And even fewer attendees of zero-committment Meetups are members of, or would follow the changes at, AA. Correlation is not causation. And not everything negative that happens to a woman is from misogyny.
No matter who runs them, freethought groups have always been disproportionately male (and white, and elderly, and straight). And humanist groups tend to be more politically liberal. Imbalances in all these categories reflect the whole atheist and humanist organizational cultures, not this short-term leadership issue.
SG-
For the record, I think that the Bill Moore walk could have been avoided, as it is – on the surface – a “black thing” and not an “atheist thing”.
On the other hand, it wouldn’t hurt to extend the olive branch to the black community, given their attachment to religion and their distrust of us.
However, once commitments were made and reputations were on the line, I’m in total agreement w/ you as to how it was handled. Ellen was disrespectfully left twisting in the wind.
I notice that there has been no public complaint from Ellen, herself. That would be because she has too much class.
That’s a big part of Ellen’s appeal as a spokesperson for American Atheists. She is easy to respect at a distance.
No one looks good close-up.
Joyce Meyer is also very attractive. But even at a distance, one can easily see that her positive attributes such as beauty and hyper-intelligence are unfortunately combined w/ extreme narcissism and profound O.C.D.
Sexism will always exist. It’s better to recognize it than to deny it.
For example, this was in an episode of Viewpoint. I emailed Ellen and called her on it.
Ellen thinks that Bill Donohue is a nice guy.
I’m not kidding!
That’s because that fat, bulldog-pussed, Irish-catholic, son-of-a-bitch, bully treats her off-camera like ANY heterosexual male would treat Ellen-
-like he’s got a chance.
Men are hard-wired to be nice to beautiful, intelligent women.
As another male, I can look into those little pig eyes and see what he is.
For that reason, I’d rather see Ron(WFBYN)Barrier go up against Donohue, O’Reilly, Beck, Hannity, etc.;->
It could be that the attendance at the meetup was affected by the political climate. I’ve been reading a bit today about sour grapes over Clinton’s failing campaign.
Michael Dorian writes:
—————-
Michael, I’m just now getting around to answering your question above.
Ellen’s “Freedom Walk,” was intended to finish the civil rights mission of Bill Moore’s march to deliver a letter to the governor of Mississippi protesting segregation in that state. Moore never completed that walk 45 years ago because he was shot through the head and murdered on a lonely road–and this ranks for many of us as UNFINISHED BUSINESS in modern atheist history.
That is why Ellen chose this event rather than any of the topics you mention above. You have to know a little history here to know the connection between Madalyn Murray O’Hair and the Bill Moore event. (And yes, I realize that you are too young to know this–you weren’t even born when it happened.)
Bill Moore was a close friend of Madalyn’s, close enough that he slept at her house when he was in Baltimore. Madalyn encouraged him in his walk, and helped him prepare for it, even to the extent of choosing what message was going to be on the sandwich board he carried.
Madalyn was utterly devastated by Bill Moore’s murder. In her autobiography, AN ATHEIST EPIC, she wrote this about Bill: “He introduced me to the writings of Albert Ellis…he was kind, he was happy, he was gentle. I think we all fell in love with him. Garth did immediately. Bill did within hours. Mother was captivated…Bill and I were simpatico and he had it going with the kids. We never even had a disagreement. We got into the damndest in-depth conversations that this world has ever heard. I thought he was a male Madalyn Murray and he thought I was a female Bill Moore…”
Madalyn describes how she learned of his death:
“Bill [Murray, her son] was standing in the middle of the living room screaming at the top of his voice…He was as white as a sheet. “Bill Moore’s been shot.”..The wail came out of Bill, ‘He’s dead!’ Someone had driven past Bill Moore, parked the car on one side and as Bill had walked past, shot him through the brain. He was killed instantly. The man’s fight with Bill had been over Atheism. When it was found out that Bill was not only a ‘Nigger Lover’ but an Atheist too, someone determined to kill him and kill him he did.”
The above quotes are from Chapter 35 of Madalyn’s autobiography,AN ATHEIST EPIC, a whole chapter on Bill Moore.
So you see, Michael, Ellen’s Freedom Walk had everything to do with Atheism as well as civil rights. And even now, there is much belief in this country that atheism is a civil rights issue.
Madalyn feared that she too would suffer the fate of Bill Moore because of the rampant hate of Atheists in this country. Atheism was, she felt, a civil rights issue along with racism. And in truth, it is. Though today we have a Black man and a woman running neck and neck for the presidency, both of them have a better chance at that office than an Atheist does. Polls show that no one would vote for an atheist today.
Madalyn did in the end suffer the same fate as Bill Moore. Though she was murdered ostensibly for her money, the fact is, the police did nothing to help her or look for her or protect her or help prevent the crime. For all intents and purposes, the police in Texas were virtual accomplices to the murder of Madalyn and her family.
At the time of Madalyn’s abduction, no one on the AA board of directors did anything that might have saved Madalyn’s life, ostensibly because there was the thought that Madalyn may have indeed flown-the-coop from the country where she was so persecuted. To this day, many board members regret that they did not do so, and wish they had done something, anything, that might have saved Madalyn, Garth and Robin from the brutal deaths they suffered. (Garth’s skull, found in Madalyn’s grave, “did not have an inch on it that was not cracked,” said the IRS agent who was among those who found the bodies–which indicates he must have put up a terrible struggle.)
Ellen Johnson was “like a daughter” to Madalyn Murray O’Hair. There’s no doubt in my mind that Madalyn would have wanted Ellen to be her successor.
And there’s no doubt in my mind that Madalyn would have wanted Ellen to complete Bill Moore’s “Freedom Walk.”
If Ellen can be faulted in any way, it’s that she did not, or could not, explain to the world, and to the Board of Directors, the deep grief she still feels about Madalyn, and her sense of obligation to fullfill Madalyn’s goals. I tried to voice that when I wrote on this blog that I imagined Ellen running down South with tears slipping down her cheeks. I can only imagine the sorrow she must have felt when the bodies of Madalyn and her family were uncovered 7 years ago. I can only imagine Ellen’s emotional need to memorialize, in some way, Madalyn’s life and death.
That is why I weep for Ellen now: I feel she has been as misunderstood by the Board right now as Madalyn’s disappearance was 13 years ago. You can’t do anything anymore for Madalyn, board members, but Ellen is still here with us. Don’t let her suffer alone and isolated now, as you heartlessly punish her for an innocent and well-meaning act that was only meant to commemorate another innocent and well-meaning act 45 years ago.
Josh writes:
“And not everything negative that happens to a woman is from misogyny.”
————
Of course not. Did I say it was?
But when a predominantly male Board of Directors (two women, I believe, and one of them is the wife of the new president)dismisses the wonderful, competent female president over something as trivial as this, you gotta believe it’s misogyny. You know how it would have been handled if Ellen were a male: the Board Boys would have listened to him, slapped him on the back, taken him out for a beer and said, OK, but next time…
————
josh also wrote:
“No matter who runs them, freethought groups have always been disproportionately male..”
Interesting. Do you have any idea why that is? It seems to contradict what several people on this blog have been saying: that male Atheists are actually less anti-woman than men in other groups.
It seems to me that we are losing women in Atheist groups and I have no explanation for it. Perhaps it’s that Atheism attracts strong-minded women and then, once they’re in, these strong-minded women find that Atheist men don’t really appreciate this strong-mindedness.
I stand corrected regarding the Bill Moore Walk. It was an atheist thing, after all.
The fact that I did not know that – and I’m an A.A. member – speaks to the lack of information provided about the event.
Smartgal-
You’re on the brink of an epiphany.
Thanks, Matador. Coming from you, that means a lot to me. You are big enough to do a turnaround on this topic.
Now if only we could touch the hearts of the Board of Directors of AA, have them reach out to Ellen Johnson and draw her back into our Atheist family.
Hey Board guys, everyone makes mistakes. This one was trivial, inconsequential. If your son or daughter had decided to go on a Freedom Walk and you said no, and they did it anyway, and nothing bad happened, would you exile that child forever? Would you disown that child? Would you change the house keys and cut off all communication?
Families don’t do that. They stick by their kids no matter what, even if those kids become druggies or dropouts or change sexes or join a cult. You don’t give up on a family member just because they did one thing you didn’t like.
Ellen is a good person, a hardworking person, honest, a wonderful speaker, a joy to behold. Come on guys, it’s time to open the door a little and see if she will come in.
It’s been twenty-eight days since the firing of Ellen was announced on this blog. The current president has done absolutely nothing to instill any confidence in AA’s members.
We were lied to, and then told to sit down and shut up when we caught on.
Support is better placed in another organization, one without an incompetent board.
Hi Smartgal,
Despite our previous unpleasant exchange, I applaud your recent statement about Ellen, and want you to know that we have told Ellen that we would be happy to resume our volunteer work with her should she choose to (and be given the option to) resume her duties.
Your statement of loyalty applies equally well to friends.
Gil and Jeanne
It seems almost unanimous….BRING ELLEN BACK! Ellen Johnson has brought intelligence, passion, dedication, diligence, loyalty, charm, and, yes, beauty (what’s wrong with that?) to the cause of American Atheists. It would seem that if enough “noise” is made, this Board, which acted (obviously) in haste, will be chastened to reinstate Ellen in a job she was meant for from the very beginning. This would certainly be a way to overcome the divisiveness of this past month. She certainly has my vote.
Thanks Gil and Jeanne Gaudia.
I always knew we were on the same page.
Let’s work together to get Ellen back.
Smartgal, If we knew how, there is nothing we’d like more, and be willing to work for, but other than writing these futile comments, it seems like we are not able to accomplish much. Is there any reliable indication that Ellen even wants to return? After all, she has been grievously wounded.
Gil and Jeanne
SG-
I was referring to the speculative statement you made in the post before mine.
However, it appears that as of recently Ellen is no longer a board member, either.
The Board, at the time of the disappearance of MMOH, was very lucky to have found someone as passionate and dedicated to the group called “American Atheists”. I can’t imagine how they will be able to find another.
If even one current board member had the vision or talent Ellen did, that person would have already been chosen from among them.
I felt secure in the knowledge that someone like Ellen was in charge of the group. She made it special. Now, I don’t feel it is any different from any other group, as far as attracting new members. It will have to compete with all the other groups now, but there had better be something special about it, or new members will not choose this one over any others. It is going to need a niche in the market.
However, it appears that as of recently Ellen is no longer a board member, either.
The Board, at the time of the disappearance of MMOH, was very lucky to have found someone as passionate and dedicated to the group called “American Atheists”. I can’t imagine how they will be able to find another.
If even one current board member had the vision or talent Ellen did, that person would have already been chosen from among them.
I felt secure in the knowledge that someone like Ellen was in charge of the group. She made it special. Now, I don’t feel it is any different from any other group, as far as attracting new members. It will have to compete with all the other groups now, but there had better be something special about it, or new members will not choose this one over any others. It is going to need a niche in the market.