http://www.propeller.com/viewstory/2008/03/06/christian-coalition-supports-guns-in-churches-bill/?url=http%3A%2F%2Fwww.ajc.com%2Fmetro%2Fcontent%2Fshared-blogs%2Fajc%2Fpoliticalinsider%2Fentries%%2F03%2F05%2Fchristian_coalition_supports_g.html&frame=true
The Christian Coalition supports H.B. 89, the gun bill that would expand the places where you can carry concealed. Churches, for instance….At the same time, Beck has declared his group?s neutrality on S.B. 454, the measure to permit the Sunday sales of beer and such at a new Braves minor league stadium in Gwinnett County.
OK Obvious jokes about God not protecting churches aside, what really irks me is that the religious group thinks it has a SAY over beer at baseball games. It’s Neutral. Big whoop. How DARE some Christian group even have an opinion about what happens outside their church, at a public event? SURE they can have opinions on whether there can be concealed weapons in their churches. But baseball??? Butt out!PS. Blue Laws are ANOTHER Separation of Church and State issue!
Ron,
Jefferson was a wise man.
In December a crazed gunman went on a shooting spree in Colorado. Lives were saved by an armed congregant serving as security.
In 1999 seven unarmed congregants were killed by gunfire while attending church in Fort Worth, Texas.
In 2005 a gunman entered a worship service being conducted at a hotel. “Terry Ratzmann, a buttoned-down churchgoer known for sharing his homegrown vegetables with his neighbors, walked into the room and coolly fired 22 rounds from a 9mm handgun, going up and down the rows.” – CBS News
Ayn Rand’s views on freedom are worthy of our consideration.
seeker,
”
Proof that even good, church going, law abiding citizens, can ‘go postal’. The problem is not with an inanimate object like a gun, it is the ease of access to guns by people that have no business having them that is the problem.
We don’t allow blind people to drive a car. We shouldn’t allow anyone with a trigger finger to own a gun. I fully support the 2d amendment, but believe there should be rigorous background checks and trianing requirements to get and maintain a concealed weapon.
brad,
Actually, I am not so much in favor of legalizing drugs, especially the harder ones, as I am in seeing them decriminalized and treated as a social problem.
Want to sit at home and smoke crack until you have a heart attack and die? As long as you are not abusing or neglecting your family, and you are not getting in your car while high and killing someone, it should be nobody’s business but your own.
I agree that treatment is much more effective than incarceration. Besides, nothing anyone does is going to stop someone from doing drugs, if they are so inclined, until that person WANTS to stop. Most people that use drugs when they are young, do in fact give them up, because of the stigma and the fact their priorities change. ie: Job, family, health, etc….
Ren,
Trust I understand the problems drugs can cause and how little incareration helps. My little brother is a major addict. Arrest 3 times and placed on probation or jailed each time. Not once was any kindof treatment plan considered rather than punishment, about 3 weeks ago my brother od and was flown to tampa where he lies on a respiratory with little brain activity. I still would rather see drtugs legal. The main reason why is that legalizing the drugs helps to reduce the criminal act surrounding it and allows for more control of exactly how the drug are made. Less ods, less innocents dying due to drug deals gone bad and more police to patrol the streets rather than bust drugs (even more if you following my thoughts on legalizing prostitution as well)
Pls excuse the mult typos, fat fingers + small keys = many errors
brad,
I am right there with you. Spent some time in Amsterdam where pretty much anything goes, and you know what? I have rarely felt safer in any city in the world. Far safer than walking the streets of Omaha, NE at night.
I agree that it is the black market that generates the majority of the crime that drugs are blamed for. When was the last time someone shot someone else over ‘turf’ to sell alcohol on? Oh yeah, Prohibition.
I guarantee that if cigarettes were outlawed today, there would be people on the streets of my small town, selling them for a dollar apiece or twenty dollars a pack. Smokers that are wasting money on cigarettes now, wouldn’t likely stop, they would simply start spending the grocery money until that ran out, then they would start stealing and prostituting themselves for their fix, causing considerably more collateral damage than what smoking alone costs.
I am sorry to hear about your brother, btw. Against all odds, I hope he recovers and gets his life back together. My thoughts will be with you and your family in this tough time.
I agree with you two, sensible drug laws would do us a world of good.
It is completely ridiculous to throw someone in jail for getting high and watching Scooby Doo. The amount of damage that these anti-drug laws have done to our country is immeasurable.
alatham,
They have completly abrogated the 4th amendment. What other offense allows men dressed in paramilitary gear, to burst into your home with automatic weapons, without first knocking and producing a warrant?
There is none! Aren’t you all glad we live in the land of the free?
in response to the gun control topic:
quick mental exercise/research opportunity.
are the safest countries in the world the ones with the strictest or the ones with the most lax gun control laws?
I remember we just has case in the atlanta area where narc team used a no knock warrent to enter an apartment. Inside was a 90 some yr old lady with a shot gun terrified. Needless to say, she fired and they fire and she died. Latter, it turned out the officers made up the information to get the warrent. Utterly ridiculus, all this blood shed only due to any eariler president wanted to have a reason to arrest protestors.
Brad
Why would you assume this to be the case?
Oh stop it. I said “Christian groups”, not “Christians”. Christians have constitutional rights, and can have all the opinions they want. Christian Groups should be worried about their people… not what non-practicing people do TO/BY/FOR themselves. Capice?
For instance, I think it’s incredibly stupid that some Catholics eat a cracker and it “becomes” the body of Jesus inside them. American Atheists worries about Atheists, and has no opinion about what Catholics eat/drink/etc.
Dave,
I started to throw in my two cents earlier and then thought better of it. I wanted to say everybody has the right to an opinion, but when religion ORGANIZES and flexes its muscle then it is sticking its nose in MY business.
But then, other groups organize and it gives their causes more muscle. So, as much as I dislike organized religion sticking its nose into issues like gun control and what can be sold or not sold on Sunday, if we banned them wouldn’t all organized groups need to be banned on every issue?
I don’t know, just wondering.
Ron, “So you are saying if the girl had a gun she could not defend herself?”
Yes, that is what I am saying.
Even more, suppose she had a gun, or that many more citizens are carrying guns around.
Someone comes up to her for some entirely innocent and legitimate reason but she feels threatened and shoots. One dead person who was as non-threatening as her.
That is bound to happen.
Dave
What’s the difference? Organized groups have the same rights under the Constitution to free speech as individuals. Do you condemn jewish groups expressing their opinions as well?
brad,
I remember the case you are talking about very well. What most people do not realize is that it happens all too often, but rarely makes the national news.
If you go to NORML’s website, you will see that it happens, sometimes several times a month, in different parts of the country. If it happens near you, you might hear about it. If it happens on the other side of the country, it may very well go unnoticed. The feds don’t like that kind of information getting out, so they pressure the media to keep it on the QT. Bad for publicity and all.
http://www.norml.org/
bernarda
Whats more guns can be taken from those who wield or hide them. You end up dead because you carried.
What,
I can’t speak for Dave, but I oppose Jewish groups lobbying our government on behalf of a foreign government; Israel.
To be fair, I am genetically predominantly Italian, and I would have the same problem with Italian groups lobbying congress on behalf of Italy.
Lobbyist should only be allowed to lobby congress on behalf of American interests. And on that note, I have no idea what the law says on the subject, but I am sure it is pretty lax.
What and bernarda,
What’s more, a person that is licensed and trained to carry a concealed weapon can be struck down with mental illness, just as easily as they can be with any other illness. I don’t guess I have to elaborate on what harm that could cause.
If I am not mistaken, both of the last two college shootings had gunmen that bought their guns legally and both passed background checks prior to purchasing them.
To wit, I would probably have a hard time passing a background check. I have never been in any serious trouble with the law, but with my mental issues, I would most likely be denied the right to purchase a handgun, and I still support strengthening the requirements for ownership.
I do NOT, however support banning the majority of guns. Fully automatic assault rifles, on the other hand, are made for efficient killing of human beings and should only be in the hands of our armed forces. Not even our police should carry them.
Isn’t having unfair opinions all religions do though!?
http://www.nationalreview.com/comment/lott200603210744.asp
take a look at this!!!
this is why we have a right to have guns!!!
?Political power grows out of the barrel of a gun.?
Mao Tse-Tung
?One man with a gun can control 100 without one. ?
Vladimir Lenin
Two things Ron, congratulations for your quote-mining and using them entirely out of context.
Then, New Orleans is an exceptional situation and it is absurd to try to make a general rule from that. NO after Katrina is hardly typical of American towns.
But what do you expect from the uber-wingnuts at National Review? And John Lott is one of the worst of the lot.
Ron,
“Deatht flows from the barrel of a gun.” Ren, 2008
?
“One man with a gun can only shoot so many, before the rest of 100 without one can beat his ass and take it from him, and shoot him with it.” Ren 2008
Ron,
Silly me. And all this time I thought it was in order to maintain a well regulated militia.
http://historymatters.gmu.edu/d/5200
http://tinyurl.com/24f3o7
Damn, when I was a church-going person the thought of people having conceeled weapons in there would have made me a bit queezy. However, it wouldn’t surprise me to find out that it happened from time to time without my knowledge. I come from a bit of a redneck area after all . . .
I do not put my stamp of approval on guns. My horse was shot on accident
and I’ve never gotten over it. I hate guns.