http://news.aol.com/story/_a/rome-unveils-rare-vatican-documents/20080222220509990001
ROME (Feb. 23) – If you are inquisitive about the Inquisition, a rare public glimpse of centuries-old Vatican documents will leave you wanting more. There are no heresy trial transcripts or descriptions of torture methods at a show on view in Rome and through March 16. Still, enough curiosities on display allow fascinating insights into how the Vatican once systematically tried to gain control over many aspects of life that had nothing to do with faith….For centuries, the archives of what was once known as the Holy Office were secret. Then, in 1998, they were opened to scholars.The intriguing show, at Rome’s Central Risorgimento Museum, is the first time the public can study a sampling of what those archives preserve….A 1703 list of rules spells out a crackdown on Huguenots and heretics and those sheltering them. Huguenots were persecuted French Protestants. A 1599 edict targets game hunters, bird hunters and fishermen who were poaching at a Vatican estate south of Rome….The Holy Office “wanted total control,” said Monsignor Alejandro Cifres, one of the show’s curators and on the staff of the Congregation for the Doctrine of the Faith, previously known as the Holy Office.The Church in past centuries had its hand in everything, ranging from “culture to literature to economics, even architecture,” Cifres said. The Holy Office relied on reports from Dominicans, Franciscans and lay people, he said, and the Church had a “network” of monitors.
Good thing there’s been such a change in the Vatican. Good thing they’re not STILL trying to force their anti-abortion, anti-gay marriage, anti-science, anti-thought drivel down our throats anymore.
Exactly right Flying Weasel.
Since a god exists only in the minds of the believers, whatever attributes it has are really just reflections of those minds. The Abrahamic god(s) does not present a flattering image of its creators.
Am I technically a Creationist, if I believe that all the gods that ever were, have been created by humans?
phreedm,
I would rather my son loose his innocence to the harsh realities of life that he will someday have to navigate through, than to maintain his innocence through ignorant bliss and fairy tales.
Rusty,
Guilty as charged. No offense taken. I am the king of the ***OT*** post. In my defense, I do not do it to derail the conversation. I use this site as a form of therapy, and sometimes I just need to get things off my chest. My apologies to all that roll their eyes when I post out in left field.
It sounds like there’s more factual evidence to put together a classroom curriculum on how people have abused religion over the millennia than there is for intelligent design courses. The inquisition, and other methods that religion used to enforce their beliefs over the ages, would be a substantial portion of that course.
But it all comes down to the same thing – a philosophy with a core set of axiomatic beliefs that are unprovable having to resort to force when some of the sheeple refuse to blindly accept those axioms as fact, or even dare to question them.
Personally, if I were to speculate on the whole situation, I would say that the christians got into the inquisition as an updated version of the roman amphitheater and its’ entertainment / intimidation factor on the populace. Another revision of the same sad old story reinventing itself.
phreedm,
Well, seeing as how I posted it as soon as I saw it on the news, I am not even sure if Dave and Ellen are aware of it, yet. Instead of just assuming they are hypocritical about it, why don’t you e-mail them and ask them what their stance is on the subject? Then, you can post their response here for all to see.
Now, back to bombing Pakistan for a moment. How is it that you support a war against a country that did not attack us, did not threaten to attack us, and had no capability to attack us, yet you are against going into the counrty that virtually every intelligence agency in the world believes is harboring UBL? Just who’s side are you on, anyway? The happiest person in the world, for the United States having invaded Iraq, is UBL. You seem to support him more than your own country. Talk about hypocricy. Sheesh!
Comment from: alatham [Member]
Hmmm…no. What church did you attend?
So we agree
But just exactly who do you want to trust to make that decision?
Comment from: alatham
I can tell you’re not a parent…
Comment from: Ren
What a perfect example of expressing the differences between the way you and I look at life…
Comment from: (: tom
I couldn’t have said it better…glad to see you and I agree on at leaset one topic…
phreedm,
So we agree
I believe in a reality based existence. And you?
phreedm,
BTW, you ignored my question why it is okay for George Bush to attack Al Qaeda/Taliban targets in Pakistan, but not Obama. Care to explain yourself, or should I just assume you have no answer?
http://tinyurl.com/2tpa23
Phreedm,
None, I was under the impression that the Christians believe the Bible is telling the truth. So when the book of revelation mentions being “tormented day and night for ever and ever” I naturally take that at face value.
Am I to assume you believe in Conditional Immortality? Or are you being disingenuous and refusing to answer my question honestly?
Insist on keeping children ignorant of the reality of social ills while also teaching them that your horrible myth is fact is child abuse.
The fact that I have no children at this time is irrelevant. I can tell you don’t like answering difficult questions.
Nothing the Catholic Church has done or will do surprises me.
As for the OT discussion and the slate of presidential candidates, with tongue in cheek, here is the only answer:
We are on a steep downhill slide. The problems we facr are so overwhelming that it is unlikely even the wisest person on the planet can fix things.
What a president has to look forward to is unbelievable stress,
frustration and criticism from all sides no matter what s/he does or doesn’t do.
Therefore, any person who openly seeks the office is clearly insane. We should endeavor not to put an obviously insane person into the Whitehouse.
The only sensible thing to do is throw the idea of elections out the window and search for the best possible candidate who is sane enough to know he doesn’t want the office. Then we must drag him or her kicking and screaming into the Whitehouse and lock him/her inside. Perhaps when s/he ceases pounding on the door begging to be let out s/he will make some small measure of progress in pulling us out of the mess we are in.
And since they did not seek the job we can hardly criticize their actions.
Comment from: Ren
Awwww…come on Ren. Give me some credit…
Of course Ellen was notified…she informed me…”I’ll look into it”…
If you’d like a copy of the subject matter of the email, contact me. I’m not going to post it on here…
Comment from: Ren
Totally…
Comment from: Ren
No…I didn’t ignore it. After all I am the only opposite view on this blog…
Simple answer actually…
We killed number 3 WITH Pakistan’s permission…
Obama stated…he’d go in and bomb “with or without” Pakistan’s permission…
Flying Weasel,
You obviously missed my point, given your simplistic answer, which should be a given on an atheist blog. Sorry I wrote over your head, next time I’ll be more elementary.
Hey Ren,
McCain may be ineligible…
He was born in the Panama Canal zone…?
Wouldn’t that be a hoot…
Get a job Phreekshow and earn your keep, you parasite.
phreedm,
Obama said if we had actionable intelligence on UBL, we would act on it, permission or not. You would let Musharraf dictate wheather or not we killed UBL? You are such a tool!
You obviously know nothing of ‘SOFA’ (Status of Forces Agreements). The Canal Zone was considered “American Soil” when McCain was born there.
My daughter was born in a German hospital, in Germany, to two American parents, serving in the military in Germany. She even has a German Birth Certificate, along with an attatched letter from the American Consulate in Frankfurt. But guess what? She is American and has ALWAYS been an American, and being born in Germany would not keep her from being president.
Now, if she grows up to be an Atheist… THAT would prevent her from being president. Hell, looking at all the smears going on against Obama, because of his Muslim Father, having the country find out that ‘I’ am an Atheist would probably be enough to keep her from getting elected president.
phreedm,
You have my e-mail addy. Send it,(pause) over!
Comment from: Ren
You’re right. I don’t know about SOFA, although I do now. Thanks.
I’m merely quoting the latest story that’s going to be a hit on McCain…
http://www.iht.com/articles/2008/02/28/america/28mccain.php
phreedm,
You are welcome about the SOFA info. Any soldier that has been stationed overseas is (had better be for their own good) familiar with their host country’s SOFA.
As far as McCain being born overseas, it is a Tempest in a Teapot. The constitutional requirement for a president to be born in America is to keep naturalized citizens like Arnold Schwarzenegger from being president, not the children of active duty military that happen to be born overseas.
Were you aware that every US Embassy in the world, no matter where it sits, is considered “American Soil”? Likiewise, foreign embassies in the US are considered foreign soil.
Is it just me, or is it so much more pleasant to exchange information cordially, than to argue?
TIME,
Flying Weasel gave a perfectly reasonable answer to your question.
I can’t tell if you’re being sarcastic or not in either of your posts.
phreedm,
You seem to be saying that we should not teach young children the difference between ‘good’ touching, and ‘bad’ touching. You’re not a Catholic priest, are you?
I’m still trying to make sense of these two posts by phreed:
I love the ellipsis following the word Period. Really hammers down that declaration.
AOL
Phreeky should come with a warning label forewarning folks of the potential hazards in trying to make sense of his blathering.
Comment from: phreedm [Member]
Comment from: (: tom
I couldn’t have said it better…glad to see you and I agree on at leaset one topic…
You agree with me, that all religions are philosophies with a core set of axiomatic beliefs that are unprovable?
You agree with me that all religions have had to resort to force over the eons when some of the sheeple refuse to blindly accept their unprovable axioms as fact, or even dare to question them?
Why is it that I seem to be skeptical about this?
tom,
Phreedm is just trying to bring you down to his level.
Of course he agrees with you, but he’ll never admit it.
Phreedm is fundamentally afraid of being wrong about his god-belief. It’s as if his whole life will cave in if he gives up a single argument.