Mother Teresa, sometimes criticized and sometimes deified, appears to have been quite nonreligious after all.(click the title for link)
“Lord, my God, you have thrown [me] away as unwanted – unloved,” she wrote in one missive. “I call, I cling, I want, and there is no one to answer, no, no one. Alone. Where is my faith? even deep down right in there is nothing. I have no faith. I dare not utter the words and thoughts that crowd in my heart.”She added: “I am told God loves me, and yet the reality of the darkness and coldness and emptiness is so great that nothing touches my soul. Did I make a mistake in surrendering blindly to the Call of the Sacred Heart?”She even compared her problems to hell and admitted that she had begun to doubt the existence of heaven and God.”The smile,” she wrote, “is a mask or a cloak that covers everything. I spoke as if my very heart was in love with God, a tender personal love. If you were there you would have said, ‘What hypocrisy’.”
Dave’s Musings:1) OK so she appears to have been downright Atheistic in her writings. why did she continue to do her work? Just to be a good person? Does this eliminate the remnants of the religion=morality thing?2) I hate the term “Crisis of faith”. It’s not a crisis. It’s a revelation of reality. An Epiphany of intellect. An happy-hour of honesty. Not a crisis by any means.3) One must wonder how many more religious leaders out there are faking it. Could it be… a lot?
phreedm,
Rant???
Seems there is yet another word you define in your peculiar way.
Oh no you di’nt….you posited that your “interpretation” of the verses explained the obvious contradiction….and I did not attack you (you would have felt it if I had)….In fact I expressed a new found pity for you….I essentially forgave you for all the unfortunate posts you have left.
Howdy all,
Been awhile since I?ve come around. Got tired of the likes of phreedm hijacking nearly every thread. And I see that he is still at it. If you notice, since his first post the entire thread has become him accusing us of not having read or not understanding the bible and then us trying to defend our knowledge thereof. Mother teresa has been forgotten.
Anyway, I wanted to weigh in on this one. In my mind mother teresa was an extraordinary individual whose accomplishments should not be overshadowed by any doubts she may or may not have had re: the existence of god or even if she could be viewed as a hypocrite. What her inner thoughts show me, is that she was driven by a desire to please her god but never got any tangible feedback or support from ?Him?. Gee…I wonder why?
The good part is that she did serve many in need, the bad part is that God and Jesus were used as a medium to accomplish it. But let?s face it. Would any of us do what she did out of the goodness of our hearts? I can honestly say, not I. Someone like her comes along maybe once in a few hundred million folks.
Looking at it another way, what she did in the name of god is far better than what a t. haggert, j. falwell, j. jackson, and countless other ?holy ones? do each day in the name of the lord. She deserves to be a ?saint? compared to the likes of them. Bet many of them don?t truly believe either. They don?t need to. All they need is people like phreedm to buy into the system and the money rolls in. Follow the money, isn?t that right phreedm ? Well when I follow it I see billions going to churches who are getting fatter and fatter all the time. For all the billions they collect they should be embarrassed at how little of it is used to help the truly needy with no religious strings attached.
oh and arguing with phreedm and those others is pointless. he doesn’t care about having and intelligent discussion with us as he may claims. he is only here to disrupt. “intelligent” and “bible” don’t belong in the same sentence or discussion anyway.
phreedm
do you have something against adventists the ones i know are nice people.
alexatheist what kind of theology student has sex outside of marriage?this is the problem with american churchs people don’t want to obey the rules.its okay not to really believe but if you belong to group you need to follow the rules or quit.these tv preachers and mega churchs are to blame for this lack of discipline.instead of religion being about self-improvement its all feelgood entertainment now.
and don’t you guys knock hypocrisy.i’ve been a hypocrite for yrs.feels like a good pair of shoes.
Ren
Oh, that WOULD be a good time, wouldn’t it? Heheh.
Sayonara
I suggest you look a little more deeply into *cough* St.Teresa. She wasn’t as goody-two-shoes as she pretended to be. That fake smile hid more than her hypocrisy about her faith.
All right, back to the Steeler game.
sayonara
I’d argue the bad part was she discouraged birth control in an overpopulated part of the earth and discouraged the use of drugs that would ease pain. However, I think you’re right that she was an extraordinary person willing to serve much more than I ever have.
sayonara,
I am also new to the blog and I completely agree with you regarding phreedm and the other xian posters.
I didn’t come here to debate with dim-witted xians about their beliefs and I am really starting to get angry about their dominance of EVERY SINGLE THREAD.
I want to discuss my thinking with like minded-people and I hope the moderator takes this post of mine to heart, if not I think I should look elsewhere for conversation.
We’ve heard everything phreedm has to say ad nauseum and I am sick of it.
To you, phreedm, please go be with your own kind and bask in the light of your god and leave us alone.
To all of the atheists here please forgive this post. Normally I would never be so rude but I simply cannot stand this anymore, if I wanted to read bible verses I would go to an xian blog.
And if I went to an xian blog and acted the way these “xians” have I would have been banned long ago, so lets either ban them from here or ignore them collectively.
I’ve found skipping over certain posts to be easy, but often the shit gets regurgitated. Thankfully the responses are more interesting than the original stupid questions.
dawnisis,
I agree with you and do apologize for my recent lack of discipline. I failed in my vow not to engage said theist, but he is so irritating. I will endeavour to do better. As I said, I now feel sorry for him because he is obviously starved for attention.
I did try to get him to quit by quoting 2Corinttians2:22- where it advises not to quarrel and to be kind, in the vain hope that he would stop but he only obeys those verses which suit his purposes.
Why are these people tolerated? At God is for Suckers they get banned and at pharyngula they are “disemvowelled”. He has had a fair chance to get his point across. Perhaps it’s time to take action.
Comment from: reason
Not at all…from the facts that Alex gave I was making a guess as the Seventh Day Adventists are the only major “christian” church to call Saturday the Sabath…
Comment from: dawnisis
Thanks for your kind words…but since you’re new…notice that 9 times out of 10 I’m NOT the one who brings up the bible or Scripture first…I am merely responding to someone elses post…
So, if you have a beef about it…speak to your “like minded” individuals…
Comment from: Obeah
dawnisis…see what I mean?
I’m not surprised by this at all, it seems like allot of people these days have to fake being Christian or Jewish in some way to be more accepted in certain areas in Western culture (such as Politics) or even stay in the “acceptance levels” of others or even keep their jobs.
Maybe, like many Atheists I’ve seen (not saying she was, but she seemed to be leaning towards it with her comments), she started out as a starch Christian and fully believed it but started to have her doubts about the religion and its belefs the more she went on. But I am guessing from what she was doing already and the supporters of her she had, she couldn’t give up. I’ve even heard of some religious figures, like priests and whatnot that stopped believing in “God” but still preached because its what they did most of their life.
I’m just hope more people start to “come out of the closet” and reveal that their an Atheist and stop trying to cover it up. The more people do that, maybe the more acceptable Atheists will become in western society and maybe be more acceptable in certain areas like Politics.
dawnisis, if phreedy is indeed a believer, which I rather doubt, he is an exemplary dim-wit.
I think he rather just likes to send people up.
“There are only 2 reasons to ask a question…
1. To Seek Knowledge…
2. To be argumentative…”
From phreedy. No one with an ounce of brains would seek knowledge in the bible.
So, either he doesn’t have an once of brains or he is being argumentative.
Dave,
Where did you find this excerpt? I’d like to read the whole article.
Thanks.
Nevermind, I just noticed the “click title for link” thingy.
“Mother Teresa” would likely have been so much happier in her life if she had just dropped the charade, come out of the closet, and returned to being plain old Agnes Bojaxhiu, agnostic, atheist, or whatever conclusion she had obviously long since come to. She must have felt that, in her position with the church and with her worldwide reputation, she had to keep up the lie. What a shame, both for all the harm she perpetrated on others in the name of something she didn’t even believe in(!), and also for all the unnecessary agony she inflicted upon herself. I don’t really feel that sorry for her, though. She didn’t have to live that lie, and what a whopper it was! And if she did do some good things, she could have done them because it was simply the right thing to do for her fellow human beings, not to win brownie points for the church.
I think you’re correct, Dave. I’m sure there are many, many religious leaders who are faking it, and millions of spineless sheeple who are faking it and/or thinking they’d better hedge their bets. Unfortunately, that whole god industry, perpetuated by liars and fools alike, continues to have a huge negative impact on our society.
Phreedm, The reason why people on this site quote the bible to you is due to the fact that it’s the one and only basis for your faith.
All you can know about your(Xtian) core beliefs come from this book.
That being the case you need to establish,the bible as infallable and inerrant.Not only that but you have to show that all other”holy books” such as the Koran and the Bhagavad Gita are false and without merit.
The Bible is full of imperfections, errancy and abounds with inconsistencies and contradictions.
The book is a veritable miasma of contradictory assertions and obvious disagreements. I am going to provide you a list of some simple straight-forward problems,see if you are able to offer us your brilliant insight.
(a) David took seven hundred (2 Sam. 8:4), seven thousand (1 Chron. 18:4) horsemen from Hadadezer;
(b) Ahaziah was 22 (2 Kings 8:26), 42 (2 Chron. 22:2) years old when he began to reign;
(c) Jehoiachin was 18 (2 Kings 24:8), 8 (2 Chron. 36:9) years old when he began to reign and he reigned 3 months (2 Kings 24:8), 3 months and10 days (2 Chron. 36:9);
(d) There were in Israel 8000,000 (2 Sam. 24:9); 1,1000,000 (1 Chron. 21:5) men that drew the sword and there were 500,000 (2 Sam. 24:9), 470,000 (1 Chron. 21:5) men that drew the sword in Judah;
(e) There were 550 (1 Kings 9:23), 250 (2 Chron. 8:10) chiefs of the officers that bare the rule over the people;
(f) Saul’s daughter, Michal, had no sons (2 Sam. 6:23), had 5 sons (2 Sam. 21:6) during her lifetime;
(g) Lot was Abraham’s nephew (Gen. 14:12), brother (Gen. 14:14);
(h) Joseph was sold into Egypt by Midianites (Gen. 37:36), by Ishmaelites (Gen. 39:1);
(i) Saul was killed by his own hands (1 Sam. 31:4), by a young Amalekite (2 Sam. 1:10), by the Philistines (2 Sam. 21:12);
(j) Solomon made of a molten sea which contained 2,000 (1 Kings 7:26), 3,000 (2 Chron. 4:5) baths;
(k) The workers on the Temple had 3,300 (1 Kings 5:16), 3,600 (2 Chron. 2:18) overseers;
(l) The earth does (Eccle. 1:4), does not (2 Peter 3:10) abideth forever;
(m) If Jesus bears witness of himself his witness is true (John 8:14), is not true (John 5:31);
(n) Josiah died at Megiddo (2 Kings 23:29-30), at Jerusalem (2 Chron. 35:24);
(o) Jesus led Peter, James, and John up a high mountain after six (Matt. 17:1, Mark 9:2), eight (Luke 9:28) days;
(p) Nebuzaradan came unto Jerusalem on the seventh (2 Kings 25:8), tenth (Jer. 52:12) day of the fifth month.
every thread really is hijacked thread.
I just realized that if I don’t know what going on in a thread I go to the bottom and and look for a troll, there comments are what everyone is always talking about.
every thread really is hijacked
sen. larry craig was arrested for lewd conduct in a airport restroom ,he got it down to a disorderly conduct charge and now says it was all a misunderstanding.
boy do we need to clean house.if we made gay marriage legal would this nonsense stop.or do we need to go iranian on these guys.
dawnisis…and more evidence…
Now…will you chastise them the same way you did me…? Some how I doubt it…
Comment from: bernarda
Comment from: IVORY GIRL
IG…I suspect that you’re knowledge of the “bible” (hope no one yells at me for saying the “b” word)…is about as well rounded as your understanding of the crusades…
I’d be glad to discuss your examples but it appears many of your comrades have thin skin and can’t take an open debate on NGB…
Please email me if you’re sincere about further discussion…
Comment from: bernarda
This statement is one of the most closed minded of late…whether you believe in it’s Words or not, there is no question that the bible contains a wealth of knowledge…
Many, many on your side will agree with that statement…you really shouldn’t limit yourself to sources for Truth…it can be found in the most unexpected places…
phreedy really likes to dig himself a hole, “there is no question that the bible contains a wealth of knowledge…”
Knowledge about what? It is just the more or less random ravings of delusional lunatics who had no knowledge even of the things they wrote about.
Paul even said that he didn’t have knowledge but he got his ideas from visions.
From Ambrose Bierce’s Devil’s Dictionary:
Faith, n. Belief without evidence in what is told by one who speaks without knowledge, of things without parallel.
Phreedm,
I really hate to throw out the old canard to you and claim argument from authority.My academic qualifications are of little relevance in this issue,but just for the record I recived a Ms in Science and a minor in political and RELIGIOUS studies.
I am at the moment completing a Doctoral in educational leadership
with a specialization in curriculum
instruction.
I’m sure my knowledge of world history and the bible falls short of
yours but I try.
Speaking of Mother Teresa, I saw in the newspaper that the first miracle attributed to her was for healing someone who prayed to her and was ‘cured’ of cancer.
Funny how it’s always something that can be a false initial diagnosis or spontaneous remission.
We’re still waiting for a miraculous restoration of an amputated limb to show up all the skeptics.
Having the Vatican investigate the possibility of a false miracle could be seen as a conflict of interest, no?
There’s two different kinds of religious people, the gullible and the hypocrits. Well no, some are surely both, so that’s three kinds. On the other hand, there might be only one category, if all of them are both gullible and hypocritical.
Comment from: bernarda
Now where did he say that…?
Comment from: IVORY GIRL
Oh really…and you didn’t know that the Crusades started as a defensive movement…?
I guess this gives credit to the statement…just because you sit in a chicken house, it doesn’t make you a chicken…
People can claim just about anything online…
But hey…good luck with your studies…
Phreedm:
Galatians 1:11
The good news I preach is not a human message that I was given by men, it is something I learnt only through a revelation of Jesus Christ.
phreedy, “Now where did he say that…?”
Anyone who doesn’t know that and has to ask the question has not read the new testament.
Just as I thought phreedy, you are a fraud.
phreedm
The Crusades of the Middle Ages were an almost continuous series of military-religious expeditions made by European Christians in the hope of wresting the Holy Land from the infidel Turks. From 1096 until nearly 1300, Crusaders, traveling in great armies, small bands, or alone, journeyed into the Orient to wage war against the Moslems, who had become a serious threat to Christianity (some what like the present day)The Christians of Europe believed that pilgrimages to the Holy Land would guarantee the forgiveness of their sins and the healing of their sick bodies and souls.By the spring of 1096, before the First Crusade was officially launched, Peter the Hermit and other wandering preachers had collected a number of motley armies, composed of peasants, vagrants, beggars, women, and children. Driven by fanatical zeal, these ignorant, disorderly, penniless crews set out from France and the Rhineland for the Holy Land.
The Christians and the Muslims were equally responsible for these stupid religious wars, but history shows it was the Christians who “cast the first stone”
Just for others that might be interested, which phreedy is not, here is a bit more from Galatians.
“15But when it pleased God, who separated me from my mother’s womb, and called me by his grace,
16To reveal his Son in me, that I might preach him among the heathen; immediately I conferred not with flesh and blood:
17Neither went I up to Jerusalem to them which were apostles before me; but I went into Arabia, and returned again unto Damascus.
18Then after three years I went up to Jerusalem to see Peter, and abode with him fifteen days.
19But other of the apostles saw I none, save James the Lord’s brother.”
Even the claimed meeting with Peter and James are questionable. Did those guys even exist for one thing?
You can also read Acts 9 and 22 and 26. Rather repetitive and boring as most of the bible.
IG…I see you know how to copy and paste…
And what was happening to Europe BEFORE 1090? Hmmmm…???????
Here’s a hint…southern Spain…
This comment confirms my suspicions…
As I stated…”good luck with your studies”… hahaha….
Are you stating that studying religion doesn’t make you religious (I agree), or that her qualifications don’t count because she disagrees with you?
I am amazed on how the bible confuses everyone!
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