Comments on: Christians on Death Row http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row A Blog of Atheist Thought Fri, 10 Feb 2012 05:40:03 +0000 hourly 1 http://wordpress.org/?v=3.3.1 By: flanonblvr http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row/comment-page-1#comment-40069 flanonblvr Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-40069 unfortunately folks like some of our xtian trolls that post here, are of the opinion that it is better to be a murderer that reforms and accepts the xtian god into his/her life than it is to be a homosexual that lives a good life and harms no one.<br /> <br /> only if their god tells them it is OK to be gay rather than a xtain murderer will they ever change their minds. since their is no god, they will never change their minds. sad but true. unfortunately folks like some of our xtian trolls that post here, are of the opinion that it is better to be a murderer that reforms and accepts the xtian god into his/her life than it is to be a homosexual that lives a good life and harms no one.

only if their god tells them it is OK to be gay rather than a xtain murderer will they ever change their minds. since their is no god, they will never change their minds. sad but true.

]]> By: http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row/comment-page-1#comment-40073 Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-40073 <blockquote>What really bothered me was that these inmates felt almost no remorse for their crimes.</blockquote><br /> <br /> "Almost no remorse"? Are you stating that the only way you'll feel good about someone in prison is if they show an emotional response?<br /> <br /> Was the question asked directly? Or are you upset that they didn't look into the camera and beg for forgiveness?<br /> <br /> <blockquote>They were "new people" now, and those crimes were committed by the person they "once were".</blockquote><br /> <br /> I believe you're mistaken here. I'll bet that if their conversion is genuine, and asked directly they'd be very sorry for their crimes. Without actually experiencing it, it is difficult to understand how one feels "free" when they realize the "Supreme Judge" has forgiven them.<br /> Not a dig. Just trying to explain.<br /> <br /> <blockquote>I really just don't like the concept of murderers and rapists sleeping well at night because "they didn't REALLY do it".</blockquote><br /> <br /> Why not? Isn't your desire that ALL can live in peace? Or do you want those that break the law, suffer for the rest of their life?<br /> <br /> If it bothers you that maybe they've made peace with themselves, exactly what kind of suffering would make you feel better about their incarceration?<br /> <br /> This is actually a great thread Dave. It will be very interesting to see how others respond. If it's kept on topic...<br /> <br />

What really bothered me was that these inmates felt almost no remorse for their crimes.

“Almost no remorse”? Are you stating that the only way you’ll feel good about someone in prison is if they show an emotional response?

Was the question asked directly? Or are you upset that they didn’t look into the camera and beg for forgiveness?

They were “new people” now, and those crimes were committed by the person they “once were”.

I believe you’re mistaken here. I’ll bet that if their conversion is genuine, and asked directly they’d be very sorry for their crimes. Without actually experiencing it, it is difficult to understand how one feels “free” when they realize the “Supreme Judge” has forgiven them.
Not a dig. Just trying to explain.

I really just don’t like the concept of murderers and rapists sleeping well at night because “they didn’t REALLY do it”.

Why not? Isn’t your desire that ALL can live in peace? Or do you want those that break the law, suffer for the rest of their life?

If it bothers you that maybe they’ve made peace with themselves, exactly what kind of suffering would make you feel better about their incarceration?

This is actually a great thread Dave. It will be very interesting to see how others respond. If it’s kept on topic…

]]> By: ang6666 http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row/comment-page-1#comment-40076 ang6666 Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-40076 <blockquote>They were literally convinced in Prison that the bad things they did were the fault of Satan, or some other "evil force", and not THEIR responsibility.</blockquote><br /> <br /> Perhaps they should lay the blame where it belongs ---<br /> <br /> Isaiah 45:7<br /> I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.<br /> <br /> --- with their god.<br /> <br /> I need someone to get a bible and tell me if it actually says that. I found that on another site last night.

They were literally convinced in Prison that the bad things they did were the fault of Satan, or some other “evil force”, and not THEIR responsibility.

Perhaps they should lay the blame where it belongs —

Isaiah 45:7
I form the light, and create darkness: I make peace, and create evil: I the LORD do all these things.

— with their god.

I need someone to get a bible and tell me if it actually says that. I found that on another site last night.

]]> By: Esperdome http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row/comment-page-1#comment-40077 Esperdome Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-40077 I do agree with phreedm, everyone has a right to forgive themselves from past deeds. <br /> <br /> Who out there hasn't done something to someone they regret. I know I have. I try to learn from it and move on. I'm not like the character in "My name is Earl", going around trying to right past wrongs, but if you forgive yourself, its easier to forgive others.<br /> <br /> I know this all sounds preachy, but it fits into my atheist world view, it may be harder for atheists because they aren't "born again", and know full well they are ultimately responsible for their own actions.<br /> <br /> Just my opinion. I do agree with phreedm, everyone has a right to forgive themselves from past deeds.

Who out there hasn’t done something to someone they regret. I know I have. I try to learn from it and move on. I’m not like the character in “My name is Earl”, going around trying to right past wrongs, but if you forgive yourself, its easier to forgive others.

I know this all sounds preachy, but it fits into my atheist world view, it may be harder for atheists because they aren’t “born again”, and know full well they are ultimately responsible for their own actions.

Just my opinion.

]]> By: reluctantatheist http://atheists.org/blog/2006/07/08/christians_on_death_row/comment-page-1#comment-40078 reluctantatheist Wed, 30 Nov -0001 00:00:00 +0000 #comment-40078 phreddy:<br /> This is an interesting topic, all right.<br /> How many of us are willing to give a 2nd chance to a major-league offender?<br /> <blockquote>"Almost no remorse"? Are you stating that the only way you'll feel good about someone in prison is if they show an emotional response?</blockquote><br /> How else are we to gauge the extent of their remorse? Lacking telepathy, it's difficult at best, seeing as none of the observers are watching these folks wrestling w/their demons in the wee hours of the morning.<br /> <blockquote>Was the question asked directly? Or are you upset that they didn't look into the camera and beg for forgiveness?</blockquote><br /> Again, provide a litmus test, other than 'I'm soooo sorry'.<br /> <blockquote>I believe you're mistaken here. I'll bet that if their conversion is genuine, and asked directly they'd be very sorry for their crimes. Without actually experiencing it, it is difficult to understand how one feels "free" when they realize the "Supreme Judge" has forgiven them.</blockquote><br /> Again, begs the question. Recidivism rates are high among repeat offenders, especially the sex offenders as I understand it.<br /> As an anecdotal example, my ex-GF had a horribly abusive hubbie. He was always terribly remorseful after each episode.<br /> He went out & did it again.<br /> <blockquote>Not a dig. Just trying to explain.</blockquote><br /> Understood, & appreciated.<br /> <blockquote>Why not? Isn't your desire that ALL can live in peace? Or do you want those that break the law, suffer for the rest of their life?</blockquote><br /> I can't speak for flanonblvr, but I do want peace. But 2nd chances are risky.<br /> Would you have had Dahmer released, for instance? Gein, Bundy, if they repented? <br /> & at the risk of sounding snarky, unfortunately, most religious folks tend to give themselves free passes on just about everything. Of course, that's just a part of the human condition.<br /> <blockquote>If it bothers you that maybe they've made peace with themselves, exactly what kind of suffering would make you feel better about their incarceration?</blockquote><br /> I think you're projecting a bit on that 1.<br /> "Don't do the crime, if you can't do the time" - Baretta.<br /> I personally think religion gives people an 'either/or' option, combined w/a passing of the blame onto some mysterious force, rather than taking personal responsibility. & that's my take on the whole thing. phreddy:
This is an interesting topic, all right.
How many of us are willing to give a 2nd chance to a major-league offender?

“Almost no remorse”? Are you stating that the only way you’ll feel good about someone in prison is if they show an emotional response?

How else are we to gauge the extent of their remorse? Lacking telepathy, it’s difficult at best, seeing as none of the observers are watching these folks wrestling w/their demons in the wee hours of the morning.

Was the question asked directly? Or are you upset that they didn’t look into the camera and beg for forgiveness?

Again, provide a litmus test, other than ‘I’m soooo sorry’.

I believe you’re mistaken here. I’ll bet that if their conversion is genuine, and asked directly they’d be very sorry for their crimes. Without actually experiencing it, it is difficult to understand how one feels “free” when they realize the “Supreme Judge” has forgiven them.

Again, begs the question. Recidivism rates are high among repeat offenders, especially the sex offenders as I understand it.
As an anecdotal example, my ex-GF had a horribly abusive hubbie. He was always terribly remorseful after each episode.
He went out & did it again.

Not a dig. Just trying to explain.

Understood, & appreciated.

Why not? Isn’t your desire that ALL can live in peace? Or do you want those that break the law, suffer for the rest of their life?

I can’t speak for flanonblvr, but I do want peace. But 2nd chances are risky.
Would you have had Dahmer released, for instance? Gein, Bundy, if they repented?
& at the risk of sounding snarky, unfortunately, most religious folks tend to give themselves free passes on just about everything. Of course, that’s just a part of the human condition.

If it bothers you that maybe they’ve made peace with themselves, exactly what kind of suffering would make you feel better about their incarceration?

I think you’re projecting a bit on that 1.
“Don’t do the crime, if you can’t do the time” – Baretta.
I personally think religion gives people an ‘either/or’ option, combined w/a passing of the blame onto some mysterious force, rather than taking personal responsibility. & that’s my take on the whole thing.

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