From our friends at AU:
The Rev. Jerry Falwell and his Religious Right cohorts have been complaining for weeks now about government agencies and store clerks saying ?Happy Holidays? instead of ?Merry Christmas? but it looks like Falwell forgot to tell President George W. Bush, First Lady Laura Bush and the Republican National Committee about the preferred religiously correct greeting.The White House?s 2005 holiday card is just out, and it doesn?t mention the word ?Christmas? once.The card, mailed under the auspices of the Republican National Committee and signed by the president and his wife, reads, ?With best wishes for a holiday season of hope and happiness 2005.? It also includes a passage from the Old Testament Book of Psalms.The front cover is an artist?s rendition of the White House and grounds covered with snow while the presidential pets, two dogs and a cat, frolic on the lawn. It contains no religious symbolism.
There will be a lot of talk about Xmas this year, but now we have GW on our side, doing the ungodly — saying “Happy Holidays” instead of “Merry Xmas”. Fallwell must hate that.So must Hannity and O’Reilly. We at American Atheists get a lot of calls from conservative talk shows during this season, mostly complaining about Xmas vs Holiday, completely ignoring the bigger issues. Sometimes, the issues are so silly we turn down the interview.I remember last year I did Hannity and Colmes about some mall in Florida calling their Easter Bunny the “Garden Bunny”. Not my idea, not our issue, but it certainly seemed like it on the show!I understand the need to remain topical, but come on folks, we need to worry about important things. Xmas v. Holiday is a small symptom of a major problem — the forced Christianization of America. Let’s work the cause, not the symptom.
Your nose sticks out funny.
HZ
I did not know that. How apt for the worship of material goods.
I actually did about 1/4 of my shopping online this year. Lots of offers of free shipping. Not as much fun as being in the store and running my fingers over chenille, or pressing all the buttons on a toy to hear all the sounds it makes, but makes up for it by not having to fight the crowds.
Having grandkids really chases away the Bah Humbugs.
r4d
HEHEHEHEHEHE
OH gee, gosh, thanks!
Karen,
If I remember correctly, you’re an artist…right?
So, if you’re like me, do you ever give your work away as gifts at Christmas. I do.
My family and friends thinks it’s the greatest thing…just don’t tell them the plein air paintings I’m giving them take less than two hours to complete and are used for practice
Unfortunately, my nieces and nephews have it figured out and don’t let me get by with it. Little punks!
And R4D is right, your nose does protrude in an unflattering manner. :—– )
karen:
Yes, I have.
spanders:
If you?re going to suggest I take the ?long view? of history, then perhaps you should too. Given that Canada was settled by exactly the same British types that the US was, it?s a bit of a stretch to say that, had they had the same agricultural economy as the US did that they (being ?more sensible than us?) would have refrained from slavery.
Maybe that?s because Canadians lack not only the moral resolve to rid the world of evil when necessary, but also lack the military resources even if they had that resolve.
Our preservation of personal freedoms, our non-socialized health-care system, our non-socialized government, our non-desire to be European wannabes, and, most importantly, our non-hatred (as a nation) of Canada as a nation.
Jcc and phreedm should move to Canada and get married.
DvanW
I have given art work as gifts, but not so much recently. I haven’t been very productive lately.
I do a lot of crafty things too, that people seem to enjoy.
I won’t give your secret away, even though my nose is out of joint! :0
MEDIA UPDATE
O’Reilly has finally revealed the ‘source’ of the War On Christmas?. Turns out it’s not us atheists at all. It’s the LIBERAL JEWS!!
http://mediamatters.org/items/200512010017
Oh God help us (dust off those gas chambers.)
jcc
But the fishing in Barry’s Bay is great!
By this do you infer that the Canadians hate us or themselves?
Because if they hate us, I haven’t detected it. But if they do, why not? The rest of the world does, because of our righteous superiority
and our intrusiveness. And I suppose because of our wealth and strength.
Did Canada treat you poorly? How long were you there?
P.S. Is our other conversation over?
Silent night, Holy night….
Bill O’Reilly is judging someone ELSE to be insane?
O..k…a….y.
r4d
Looks like he’s still blaming secular progressives to me. I didn’t see anything about liberal Jews.
When did we cook up a conspiracy? How do I get in on it?
I was extrapolating from his previous statements about Soros. And I was being facetious (as usual.) I think it’s pretty funny how he always ends up pinning these phantom conspiracies on Soros – as if the guy has a goon squad that goes around threatening department store CEOs.
r4d
I don’t know if I’d have made the connection anyway, but i missed the previous statements about Soros.
At least O’Reilly knows the true meaning of Chri$$$$$$tmas.
Sorry:
Chri$$$$$$tma$$$$$$
…. evils such as evolution, homosexuality, wildlife preserves, free healthcare, and curling. Those evil fucking bastards.
jcc:
Wow. How conservative. How very….Republican. Couldja get a little more to the right, please? Think you missed an area.
I’m 1/2 tempted to label you a Canuck-o-phobe.
Getting off topic, got problems w/the 2nd 1. No, not a soc_ialist. Presently, can’t afford ANY medical insurance. So if something drastic happens that results in hospital stay, I’ll have to file bankruptcy (which I’m pretty close to anyways).
& hey, I’ve always wanted to be French.
More a lover than a fighter, I’d like to think (though the French actually created a martial art that’s recognized by the World MA assoc., the ONLY European MA that I know of, called Savate.)
My pardon, sir, but it seems like you look down your nose at Canadians. If not, apologies.
The killed Kenny.
JCC
Okay, so what I think you’re saying is that slavery was an issue of pragmatics and not being morally sensible or not. I can’t honestly say why they did or didn’t. I can only look at it and say they didn’t and we did. I’m not sure they were exactly the same British either. I think there was a bit more French influence as well as a slightly enhanced willingness to not wipe out the natives. It is interesting to note that the natives living in the southeast also used slave labor before the influence of white men. That may bolster your argument for pragmatics, but if we’re talking sensibility I guess we should discuss pragmatic sensibility vs. moral sensibility. If we’re more morally sensible (which is what I think you’re suggesting), wouldn’t
slavery have been abolished right away? I don’t think one can argue higher moral sensibility for the US in this case. It just doesn’t hold up.
I think there are a number of problems I have with this argument. You are assuming higher moral sensibility when we rid the world of evil. So how do we apply this standard uniformly? No question, Saddam is a bad guy. Based on your argument, wouldn’t we be invading a myriad of countries to rid the world of evil? Why do we parse meanings about genocide when we should be doing something about it? Is there no evil in Darfur? Liberia would have been a top priority.
How do we define evil? Based on human rights violations Saudi Arabia would be a good start. Connections to terrorism? Let’s go to Iran and Saudi Arabia (again). How about North Korea? Do we not have the moral resolve to go and do something about them? Maybe we lack the military resources even if we wanted to.
I don’t think this argument even holds up under pragmatic sensibility. Our leaders ignored the history lesson of the failed British occupation following WWI. They even said the same “We’ll be greeted as liberators”. After a while, the british public got sick of the body count and the cost. When they left the power vacuum allowed only the most violent and vicious to be in power. Who would have thought?
Our own generals told the commander in chief we needed more troops to do it right. They didn’t listen. Our own generals say insurgencies last about 9 years normally and there’s no reason to think this will be any shorter. Our VP told us it’s in its last throws. So, I don’t buy the either the pragmatic or moral sensibilities argument.
I’ll need some clarification here. I see gay marriage and rights to abortion as preservation of personal freedoms that either don’t exist or are being eroded. I don’t think the Canadian government has passed laws that have traded personal freedoms for security. Whether you see it as useful or not, I don’t think the US has outshined Canada on personal freedoms.
I gave you my rational for single payer health care, but you haven’t elaborated on why you think our system is better. It’s better for those who can afford it, but the rest might argue a bit differently. Are you provided health benefits or do you pay fully for yours? Since I pay fully for mine, I feel I would rather pay higher taxes and cover more people and pay less in health care coverage. I would rather pay that $400 a month to funding the buying power of a single payer system than $400 a month to the only company in NC to really offer anything to small businesses and give me bad service.
I’m not sure what you mean by European wannabies. Can’t we learn from them? I haven’t seen hatred from Canada. Can you provide me with an example?
flanonblvr:
Hey, for a middle-aged unemployed male, I’m healthy as an ox.
It’s just that life changes in a New York minute, & a ‘ounce of prevention is worth a pound of cure’.
Yeesh. Am I doomed to a life of platitudes, homilies, & cliches as I get older?
I get hit by a bus tomorrow, & survive, I’m toast for the rest of my life, is all.
I appreciate your input. About the only wrong things I do is smoke (sorry, r4d) & drink coffee (which is rich in antioxidants).
But I work out all the time (Tai Chi), TRY to stick w/a mostly vegetarian diet, water (garlic’s good stuff, maynard!), etc.
Of course, genetics has a big say in it too.
reluctant and rainbow:
“Chairperson” is as gender specific as “chairman.”
person = per son (for every son)
perdaughter = per daughter (for ever daughter)
Seeker,
That’s okay. Pretty soon we’ll be forced to ditch the english language and start communicating in binary anyway.
healthcare is a tough issue. i never thought i would be in favor of nationalized healthcare because i didn’t want bureaucrats decideibng what doctors should do. but the healthcare plan bureaucrats do that anyway so that argument went out the window.
after fighting with the healthcare plan folks for yeras about what is covered anmd what is’t and who i can go see and who i can’t, i tried something different and it set me free (like becoming an atheist)
i carry “catastrophic” coverage for a family of 4 for about $175 a month. i have worked deals with the doctors we see if we pay cash. most charge less than $50 per visit. they all love this since no forms need to be filled out.
if you don’t need exotic drugs and if you opt for old-style antibiotics (those that you take for 10 days instead of the super 3-5 day type) you can get most prescriptions for less than $20 if you pay cash.
i got my employer to give me a $5000 a year raise since they were kicking in $6000/yr for me when i was covered through work. i was paying an additional $6000/yr. So the healthplan folks collected $12,000 per yr and i still paid about $2000/yr out-of-pocket, and i had to fight with them constantly.
now i spend less than $2000/yr for catastrophic coverage and about $1500 per year for doctors and medicine. i place the difference for what i used to spend into my 401k plan. we also go to any doctor we want (after cutting payment deals).
why did i explain all this…. well i think a lot of people are just hung up on having “full” healthcare coverage. most don’t need it and pay 2 to 3 times what value they receive. once you get past the “i have to have this” mentality it’s a piece of cake.
have been doing this for 2 years and have found that doctors tend to not overdue testing and such when they know you are paying for it. they also give free samples when possible to avoid prescription costs. Example – i saw my doc last month for a $38 cash visit and he gave me 10 days of antibiotic samples.
RA you may want to look into something like this unless you have a condition that requires recurrent expensive monthly drugs.
natural treatments also help to defray costs. i use diet, garlic and cinnamon to control my chlolesterol. that avoids about $100/mo for drugs and saves my liver so i can ruin it with tequila.
didn’t mean for this to get so long but if it helps one person then i feel like it was worth it.
Seeker:
Well, philologically speaking (did I spell that right?), you’re correct. Never heard anyone say ‘perdaughter’, however.
The general discussion is about the patois.
jcc:
Well, lessee, WWII was the last time (that I know of), where this nation actually battled malevolent evil. A large % thereafter were folks that America put in power. Saddam, the long-term ramifications of ousting Mossedegh are 2 that spring to mind. Afghani Mujhadeen.
Seems like we’re always using someone else’s backyard as a toilet.
The USSR turned out to be a large scale societal Enron, to my limited knowledge. Turned out the ‘Evil Empire’ was mostly hot air, smoke & mirrors. Will take correction in this.
I’d heard a rumor (from a retired naval officer while I was in China in 2003), that Iraq invaded Kuwait because Kuwait was stealing their oil. Hearsay, don’t have details. Again, willing to take correction in this.
There always seems to be details left out of the stories we’re told.
Maybe just me. Seems that way, though.
Seeker:
You bastards!
Hey, didn’t SP stop doing that?
Oh, BTW, Polio Bonedapart is pretty much a bot (not a news flash).
I did a search on his/her/its last racist rant, apparently that person has been kicked off a few blogs & whatnot, saying the same bloody thing (not gonna mention the nick used: it’s offensive).
Then again, perhaps SWINTBN has descended further into the spiraling madness we witnessed not long ago…..Brhhh!
Savvy Solistice, everyone.
hmmmm….
found here… http://www.teleread.org/blog/2003_10_05_archive.html
Last night the home schoolers got him.
jcc,
No, I’ve never lived there, but given what my friends that visit there say, my friends that live there say, what I’ve seen and read about Canadians through various media, and the fact that practically every remark I ever hear about the place is positive, weighed against the TON that I do know of THIS place, I feel I can safely make that statement.
I don’t need to add much more to this topic as Spanders has been most inspirational and informative. I think you’re right, karen, the homosexual thing has probably touched a nerve with jcc. He may also be jealous we never hear of any “U.S. wannabes”.
“Maybe that?s because Canadians lack not only the moral resolve to rid the world of evil when necessary, but also lack the military resources even if they had that resolve.”
Jean Bertrand Aristide, former corrupt leader of Ha?ti would dissagree with that statement. He blames Canada for spearheading his “forced” exile.
WW2? Ask the good folk of Normandy. Over there you just mention you are a canadian and you get invited in for a stay.
Of course irak is better off without Saddam, but he’s a kitten compared to some dictators in african countries. Millions dead in civil war and brutal repression. Where is Team America, world police when you need them? Oh right, no oil in Africa.
We did send troops and ships for gulf war 1. Irak had invaded another country.
Gulf war 2 is another story.
The feeling about gulf war 2 was that there were a LOT of other countries where intervention was needed even more badly then Irak and yet nothing was done (Soudan, Liberia). The only reason we could see of someone invading Irak was oil and lucrative contracts.
Did the troops find WMD? No.
Did they find oil? You betcha.
Did Haliburton get juicy contracts? Of course they did.
So in the end, we can only feel justified about refusing to send troops in Irak.
Canada DID send troops in Afganistan to relieve US troops. We all know how that ended. 5 deads. One in a jeep accident; Shit happens.
4 killed by a US pilot who dropped a bomb on training troops after ordered twice not to fire. No excuses offered after the fact.
A friend of mine was born in Chili. Needless to say he’s not very happy of the US ousting an elected president and putting Pinochet in charge. Some of his family “dissapeared” under Pinochet.
THAT is why Canada seldom supports millitary action. Too often it is done for the wrong reason and almost always ends badly.